>> COMING UP ON "NEED TO KNOW," YOU HEARD FROM THE TWO PEOPLE WHO WANT TO BE OUR COUNTY EXECUTIVE DURING OUR VOICE OF THE VOTER DEBATE YESTERDAY.
NOW LET'S HEAR DIRECTLY FROM THE VOICE OF THE VOTER.
REACTION TO THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE DEBATES AND THE RETURN OF THE BUSINESS SECTION WITH THE "DEMOCRAT AND CHRONICLE," UP NEXT ON "NEED TO KNOW."

>> THANKS FOR JOINING US.
I'M MICHAEL CAPUTO.
WELCOME TO OUR CONTINUING SPECIAL COVERAGE OF ELECTION 2003.
YOU MIGHT NOTICE THAT WE'RE NOT IN OUR USUAL PLACE AND WE'RE JOINED BY MORE THAN THE USUAL COMPLEMENT OF PEOPLE.
WE'RE ON THE SET OF THE NOW CONCLUDED DEBATE BETWEEN THE MONROE COUNTY EXECUTIVE CANDIDATES, MAGGIE BROOKS AND BILL JOHNSON, AND WITH US ARE THE SIX PEOPLE WHO HELPED QUESTION THOSE CANDIDATES.
OUR VOICE OF THE VOTER PANEL.
ALSO JOINING US ARE REPRESENTATIVES FROM OUR MEDIA PARTNERSHIP, JOE SPECTOR, POLITICAL REPORTER FOR THE "DEMOCRAT AND CHRONICLE" AND KATHY KRIZ, SPECIAL PROJECTS REPORTER FOR WOKR, NEWSSOURCE 13.
WE'RE GOING TO TALK A LITTLE ABOUT THE DEBATE AND THE ELECTION IN GENERAL.
BUT FIRST I WANT TO REMIND YOU THAT THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE'S DEBATE IS ONLY THE START OF OUR ELECTION COVERAGE.
NEXT THURSDAY THE VOICE OF THE VOTER COLLABORATION WILL HOST A DEBATE BETWEEN THE TWO PEOPLE RUNNING FOR DISTRICT ATTORNEY, DEMOCRAT MIKE GREEN AND REPUBLICAN ANN MARIE TADDEO.
THE NEXT NIGHT, "NEED TO KNOW" WILL FOCUS ITS PROGRAM ON THE ART OF CAMPAIGNING AND THE MESSAGES BEING DELIVERED THIS CAMPAIGN SEASON, THEN WE'LL HAVE EXTENSIVE ELECTION NIGHT COVERAGE AFTER THE POLLS CLOSE.
NOW I'D LIKE TO WELCOME IN TONIGHT'S GUESTS, THE VOICE OF THE VOTER PANEL THAT GRILLED JOHNSON AND BROOKS.
FROM MY IMMEDIATE LEFT AND WORKING DOWN WE HAVE ROSA SMITH-MONTANARO OF GREECE, STEVE RODRIGUEZ OF ROCHESTER, MELANIE BUCK OF ROCHESTER, AN ON MY IMMEDIATE RIGHT AND WORKING DOWN IS KIRKE WHITE OF INRONDEQUOIT, KATHLEEN ALBERTINI OF HONEOYE FALLS, AND JACK MURPHY OF GREECE.
THANKS FOR BEING WITH US FOR THIS SPECIAL "NEED TO KNOW."
I want to ask you this off the bat.
I look at a debate how somebody read ago novel might look at that.
It is a personal experience viewing the debate as it would be reading a novel, but I think we will bring something to this that will be a little different.
From your perspective, what did you get from this debate?
What hit home for you in this debate?
Don't hit me now.

>> well, first of all, I thought that it was a very aggressive, they seemed to be very adamant about their positions, going at each other more so than I thought they would in this kind of forum, and I think that sort of took away from potentially answering our questions a little bit more directly on this.
They sort of wanted to go at it with each other as opposed to talking about the issues.

>> is that what people saw?
Everybody saw the same thing.
KirkE, did you see an aggressiveness here?

>> yes, definite my an aggressiveness.
I come away really concerned about how mayor Johnson is going to work with a republican county legislature and county that most of the towns are controlled by republicans in a way that he is attacking the jack Doyle administration.
At the same time Maggie brooks, she's going to have a very difficult time, I think, working with the city and working with the mayor, who will still be there as he pointed out in the debate.
I don't know, I think the aggressiveness is not serving us well.

>> do you think that's a carryover from what we saw over the last few years?
A lot of people have talked about jack Doyle and bill Johnson and their relationship and it hasn't been so good.
Do you think that was a carryover, do you think it's institutional, is that the way it works with city and county in this area?

>> no.
I think -- I think it appears that Maggie is trying to distance herself from jack Doyle.
Obviously a county budget is a big item right now and the mayor is going to make -- he's going to make I think a that a big issue and it certainly should be a big issue.
We're looking at a large shortfall.
I agree with some of my colleagues here.
They started to hammer each other a little bit, and it was taking away from the issues.
As a matter of fact, the mayor to my question said, I really didn't get an answer after Maggie did a rebuttal, I didn't get an answer from the question from either one of them, let alone that, but I also -- I saw that too, this aggressiveness, and I think KirkE has a good point, that aggressiveness carries over if Maggie becomes the county manager and you have Johnson in there as a mayor, I'm 0 not too certain if four years down the read, they won't be talking to each other.

>> is there anything you heard that you say oh, wow, I can't believe they said it or was there anything that surprised you?

>> she's still going to be mayor if she wins.
I thought that was surprising because I -- from what I've seen of Maggie brooks, it seems like she really wants to work together and wants to find ways to resolve this and I've often wondered how mayor Johnson would work with her because I know he has this tension with jack Doyle, so I've been curious to see if he would be more receptive to work with her and he sort of alluded to that with that comment, this isn't going to get easier.

>> anybody else?
No surprises here?

>> I was surprised when Maggie said she would be a candidate for change and never explored that issue.
The theme is coming across from Maggie brooks, I'm not going to raise your taxes.
OK.
You know, next question obviously, but you are going to cut services or you aren't going to cut services.
I don't think she was that definitive on that.
What's its change that she's talking about?
Is it bringing together this multitude of groups that we have out in the community, that quite frankly I don't think the community sees so many groups talking about so many issues, that you no longer can focus, you know, on the situation in general.

>> I want to hear from somebody who hasn't spoken.
Kathleen, do you feel like they answered your question?

>> no, they didn't answer my question.

>> everybody feel that way?

>> it's difficult to do in two minutes, answer questions, espouse their views, their platforms and sort of tell you why the other person is not the right person.
I think it's difficult to do in two minutes and then a 30-second rebuttal.

>> I agree with that, but I also think that we could have gotten, with some issues, a more definitive answer just for the short term, just for things that you think they could see that they would be able to enact and do.

>> what should they have said?
And again, make this a question to you in a more personal sense as a voter, what should they have said to you tonight?
What really mattered and you had had to have heard tonight?

>> I would like to have heard how Maggie's experience in the county government currently, specifically gives her strength and credibility to be the county manager and her comment about, well, my budget is in and my budget is $1.6 million in surplus, was a horrible way to do that in the sense of you are in the county, you are a part of the county as the clerk and how do you work with the other people if she talks so much about collaboration.

>> I think there was more a sense of there was an issue.
This has to be addressed.
This has to be spoken about.
I'm not going in the voting booth not knowing what this person is saying.
Tears something along those lines, even on a broader sense where --

>> the deficit, neither of them answered what they would do in the face of the deficit, and I asked that question and Joe asked it again.
I didn't think either of them said what they were going to do.

>> does everybody agree?
Do you feel as though they didn't answer that question?

>> it was deflected by the mayor in the sense that well the budget is not in, which is fine, but you know, we need to sort of, if it's $10 million, $50 million, what do we begin to do?
Obviously to get the $50 million, you have to pay off $10 million anyway, so how do we get to $10 million, how do we get to $20 million.

>> he knows there is a problem, he knows there is something you need to address, you can't just be put under until well, when it comes in, we can talk about it.

>> that was a big point.
The mayor had a strong point there.
You know, coming in to office the first week in January and you're blessed with this budget from the from the legislature, what can you really do about it.
This was in Joe Specter's article on October 12, that's where Maggie partially answered my question and it's the first time in over the last couple of years --

>> what are you referring to?

>> this is the article that Joe wrote and entitled "candidates take on the tough economy," and so the questions and answers.
But anyway, the question, what would be the first action you would take as Monroe county executive to try to project new life into the local economy, wasn't really a very strong initial answer because she said the first answer would be for me to initiate.
However, in the latter part of that answer, she said we want to bring all the stakeholders together to the table, which she was reiterating today, and we need to put together a vision for the community, not just for the city, not just for the county.
This is what I thought was partially answering my question.
What do we want as a community.
We do not have that vision and you can't go forward until you have that vision.
There was no vision out there from either candidate, but if fairness to them, there's no vision out there from state legislature for the state of New York either.
But that's what I was looking for really and I never got it.

>> this is the first of several debates and certainly the next couple of weeks you'll hear more and more about where the candidates stand on various positions.
Do you feel like walking away here today you said OK, you know, I know who I'll vote for, I heard what I wanted to hear from one person or the other and I'm ready to make my decision or do you still feel like there's time over the next week or two to think about it and come up with a decision?

>> well, I came in undecided and I'm leaving undecided, so I feel that I understand the two candidates and the basic messages they're trying to get out much better.
And also this is my first exposure to them personally, closeup so to speak, and I have a better handle on their personality, so I think it's moved me along the path toward making a decision, but I want to see how they respond to this budget when it comes out.

>> anybody else?
Anybody else make a decision?

>> I haven't made a decision, but I did like Maggie brooks talked about getting people to communicate and wanting to focus on that.
I felt she was more focused on the solution rather than just coming at mayor Johnson, so I think it's -- she's moved up in my mind.

>> a lot of people like to read into body language during a debate and I'm curious to know from all of you what your perceptions of how both of them portrayed maybe what they were trying to express and what they were feeling in their body language.
Did you pick up on anything?

>> it seemed to me that -- now Maggie brooks is trained, a trained professional, so she was leaning forward and projecting in an earnest -- I think it was a way of also projecting a newness and an energy.
The mayor on the other hand sat back and I think the way he projected himself in terms of his body language was a comfort in himself, a comfort with what he would do with his positions.
So I think they both scored points that way.

>> the body language before they went on camera was very interesting to me in that potentially they're in a situation with voters, they both walked in, sat down, didn't give a glance toward the voters or anyone else.
Which I thought as a candidate, that's interesting, that you're not making eye contact or glancing at the people that are going to hire you.

>> was it a smart move do you think, to do that?

>> no.
It is not a smart move.

>> no.

>> why?

>> because we're the ones who are going to be voting, and just making contact with people is a way to connect with people.
And to then have your words carry through with the eye contact that you've made.
Even if they didn't shake hands.

>> I've got to ask this, how much of it is performance?
How much of what you see with these kinds of things is performance?

>> I honed right in to that and I saw that there was to contact, which to me, as a performance artist, that was one continuing that you would not want to do because these are, you know, six, seven, eight, whatever, how many ever people are going to be here, potential voters in your midst, you want to mike contact, and if you are a person who is trying to get votes, you want to make contact with the people that are going to be voting.

>> but you want to make contact sometimes with the camera.
You by and large, you know, making contact with us is probably a good thing, but I think they have to make contact with the camera.
That might be part of what goes on there.
I did hear, I thought I heard a little bit from you, KirkE, that you did get something out of this.
You didn't say that you've decided who you're going to vote for, but it sounded like you got something more out of this.
Would people say that you got something out of this exchange even if they weren't always answering your questions?

>> did you -- can you walk out of here with something in your pocket?

>> there were definitely some things that I thought they touched upon, both of them, pretty well.
For instance, Maggie spoke about -- and I guess pair Johnson has referred to it as sort of a metro government where it's not county versus city or city versus county.
It's an incorporation to reduce service costs by reducing how many things are done over and over and over again, so I thought that was particularly interesting.
The other thing is they both seem to understand that Rochester needs to be marketed as a viable place for businesses to come to, whether it's through the port of Rochester or, you know, companies coming from other locations in the country.

>> how important is it for a government official to be involved in that effort of marketing?

>> I think they need to support it at least, to be on board and be able to communicate in case there is some good candidates that want to come.

>> monetarily?

>> where are funds or just we have --

>> someone has to be appointed to organize these sort of things, whether mayor Johnson referred to sending -- I don't remember the gentleman's name, about the -- he had some experience.
Sure, you can send the person, that's his ballgame, but you still need a point man back home coordinating these kind of efforts.

>> that's what they're saying about the -- what's that, the Rochester business.

>> the Rochester business --

>> G.r.a.

>> g.r.a., greater Rochester enterprises.

>> they're saying we have this really if place and we'll bring together all these other agencies.
I agree.
The question is, I think the mayor was saying, well, if it has to be the private sector to do this, I thought that was one his positions.
Maggie was saying, well, government should be a facilitator.
I think they're both agreeing, -- there's two things I thought they generally agreed on.
One, that there are too many agencies trying to build the economy.
You know.
I mean, we've just got every day in the paper, there's a new one that comes up, etc., and I think the people back off from that and they say well, why can't we put these under one umbrella, etc.
The other one they agreed on was the -- I thought on education, although I didn't agree at all with the --

>> let me.

>> oh, go ahead.

>> I'm just going to ask this if I can take a minute here.
Did you get -- everybody came in here with some sort of message to send.
What did you think the one message was that each candidate wanted to send, let me ask you that?

>> I think pretty clearly the message that Maggie brooks wanted to send was that her message about holding the line on taxes, her message about bringing a change in leadership, which is an interesting thing since she's in a sense representing an administration that is in existence.
And that she could get people to work together.
Mayor Johnson on the other hand, I think he was attempting to show a greater understanding of detail and thereby play up the experience that he had and that's how I viewed it.

>> Kathleen, do you agree?

>> yeah, those were the differentiations that I saw as well, the building on the leadership that -- or the experience that mayor Johnson has had and again, the change of leadership point, and you make a good point, that she's in the administration, that she's saying is -- she's changing from.

>> do you think this election has meant something different to people in Rochester than other ones?
You have Kodak being the Kodak announcement, we have I guess now the budget crisis has occurred.
And there's always the talk that people don't really pave attention to politics anymore.
Is that true in Rochester?
You're probably the exception.
You've been immersed in this.
If you weren't immersed in this, would you be paying attention in all honesty?

>> I probably would have to say no.
I wouldn't be as interested.

>> why?

>> because I tend -- in my circle of friends and people, that is just not what we're talking about.
We want -- we look at our -- what's going to happen for us tomorrow and that's trying to get jobs for later.
But then we start talking OK, what's going to happen within the budget, but then we don't go to like the neck level sometimes of what's happening within the politics because that is an issue that a lot of people like to stay away from.

>> jack, same question.

>> I talk to a great number of seniors who quite frankly are like, well, that's politics.
That's the answer you'll get back.
It will never change.
That sort of thing.
There's an interesting thing that I think could be done and I think the media could play a big role in this.
We all agree that there's a crisis, it may not be as deep rooted as buffalo, but all the statistics we keep getting out is that we're moving and it's definitely moving in that direction.
What I'd like to see the media, and I think the "Democrat and Chronicle" did this a week ago, wasn't there a two-page ad in there, they talk about the various things?

>> there was like a comparison almost.

>> there is a dictum if you want to call it that, in marketing, is that you shock people, if you want them to buy.
You're telling life insurance.
Can you think of anything else worse to sell than life insurance?
But you indicate, OK, there's a need here, and if you don't do it, there's big risks.
I don't think the community at all realizes where we are today and I don't think that message --

>> do you agree with that?

>> that message is not coming out.

>> do you think we're if trouble?

>> we have to look at where we're at because we have a crisis with jobs leaving Rochester.

>> this typically has been a three-horse town with Kodak, Bausch & Lomb, and I think people are aware that there's problems in the city.

>> I think people are are aware of the problems, but I also think that there's so much -- so many other things going on right now, the war in Iraq, in Afghanistan, the fight on -- worldwide fight against terrorism.
I think people are, you know, to have one more problem, to say, oh, no, the problems aren't way out there, they're here too.
People just don't want to hear.

>> I want to thank you all again.
I think it's a tribute to all of you for being here and helping with trying to get the questions that really matter to the candidates.
I want to thank you all for doing this.
I want to thank Kathy Kriz from WOKR, Joe Specter from the "Democrat and Chronicle" and now coming up, we're going to have the business section with the "Democrat and Chronicle."
.

>> WITH US IS ELLEN ROSEN, BUSINESS EDITOR FOR "THE DEMOCRAT AND CHRONICLE"
welcome, Ellen.
Paychex, what's in the name?

>> they're suing E-chex that they say sells the same products and say is infringing on their patent that has a name similar to payChex.
This is a long-time dispute.
They came out with E-checks, which looks a lot like paychex, E-CHEX, and now payChex has filed suit, seeking $10 million in damages.

>> we've been speaking all month about politics.
We're in the middle of an election season.
The candidates were talking about melding economic services.
Can you talk about what that's about?

>> what they're talking about is a group that is combining all of the economic development, both city, county, public, private all in to one kind of group.
It's a -- it's something that's been talked about in a variety of levels.
Different people have different ideas.
Maggie brooks talked about combining city and county, creating this overall arching board that would sit on things.
People are talking about different things.
How well that is going to go over because everybody has their turf.

>> we've seen the chamber and the I.M.C. merged.
I think they wanted that to be a little bit of an impetus.

>> that's what Tom moony told us.
We merged once, we can merge again.
But is private business willing to give over control to government?
I don't think so.

>> so it's democrats proposing this.
What is the chance that this comes to fruition?

>> it's interesting because both the democrats are proposing it but brooks is also proposing it, so obviously people are thinking of it on both sides of the aisle.

>> we haven't been together for a while.
I'm glad to have you back.
This was in the news last week.
Rochester gas and electric has been pushing its case to raise rates.
How is the utility company trying to justify this?

>> basically, their rates have been flat or declining for a number of years.
They say they're losing money, they cannot continue to provide services, put money into the physical plant to maintain the system the way they need to with the rates staying the same as they are.
Now the public service commission who has to approve the rate increases has balked at every time HG & -- RGE has talked about raising rates.
Last year they asked for a rate increase.
The P.S.C. held rates, but RGE immediately put in for another rate increase.
Now the new president is trying to take his case to the people and make them understand that this isn't just about the utility pocketing more money, it's about them providing service.

>> taking them to the people means taking out ads.

>> RG & E has often done that, but combined that with public discussions and communications through the media.
Since they've been purchased by energy east has happened a lot less frequently.
This was the first interview that the president has granted since taking the job.

>> is there -- I got to imagine the business community in again, probably they're balking at this.
Have they made any efforts to talk about what a rate increase might mean to their cost of doing business if Rochester?

>> we haven't heard a lot from the business community.
Anything that drives up the cost of doing business and that's when he talk about the cost of doing business if Rochester, in this community, in which we did in our fighting for Rochester futures series, the high utility costs are the things people are complaining about.

>> Kodak, we've heard them talking about they're trying to transform, take it to the streets if you will.
Talk about their marketing.
What does a Kodak moment going to mean?

>> it's going to mean something different.
They need to get away from their traditional cash cow film as just a company that sells you photographs to a company that sells you ink jet printers and moving into the digital realm.
They need to transform their public image.
They need to come out with this multimedia campaign to think of Kodak as a different company, providing medical technology, digital tech following and other things.

>> tell us what's coming up this Sunday.

>> we are going to take you to a place that very few Rochesterans have to go but some hope will become a major attraction.
I'm not going to tell you.
You have to read the paper to find out.

>> thanks so much for being here.

>> IF YOU'RE INTERESTED IN LEARNING ABOUT OTHER ISSUES, YOU CAN REVISE IT'S PAST "NEED TO KNOW" BROADCASTS.
YOU NEED TO HAVE VIDEO ON DEMAND SERVICE THROUGH TIME-WARNER CABLE.
JUST GO TO CHANNEL 709, WHICH IS ROCHESTER ON DEMAND, AND FIND BACK "NEED TO KNOW" BROADCASTS THERE.
NEXT WEEK, VOICE OF THE VOTER PRESENTS A SPECIAL DISTRICT ATTORNEY'S DEBATE.
IT WILL BE LIVE, THURSDAY NIGHT AT 9:00 P.M., AN ON "NEED TO KNOW," THE NEXT NIGHT, A LOOK AT THE ART OF CAMPAIGNING.
WE'LL SEE YOU THEN.