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Made Possible by the U.S. Department of Education]
>>
Just ahead on need to know, state legislators are
reworking governor Pataki's budget and the main point of discussion
is
spending on education.
That means plenty if you have a child in college or grade
school.
Today's program is dedicated to education with a look at the
state budget's impact on it and we'll have a story on how
prekindergarten classes are faring in our community.
That is next on "Need to Know."
>>
Unlike Albany, our community members get it.
They understand what this is doing to us.
They understand the damage that this is causing.
>>
This is "Need to Know," the Rochester area's only
in-depth
news program.
"Need to Know" is a production of wxxi public affairs,
covering
issues on politics and current events.
>>
"Need to Know" is made possible by Dorschell lexus
and
through viewers like you.
>>
Thanks for joining us.
I'm Michael Caputo.
Wxxi is part of a collaborative effort with the Democrat and
Chronicle and wokr-tv that looks at issues facing Rochester.
It's called fighting for Rochester's future.
With education as the
collaborative focus this month and with the state budget so
much in play this week, "Need to Know" will devote
itself to
the way Albany is impacting our teaching institutions.
Where are we right now?
For four weeks, four weeks after a state budget was due, state
legislators finally got to work on passing a spending plan
for
the 2003-2004 year.
Governor Pataki has been firm in his position of avoiding
tax
hikes and improving a deficit situation by making program
cuts
and finding revenue from other sources.
No one knows that better than educators and students in the
state university of New York system.
Pataki has proposed a tuition increase at SUNY colleges of
about
$1200, $200 less than what the SUNY board of trustees
advocated.
At the same time, he called for reducing the amount of tuition
assistance to students while deferring some payments.
This week, however, state lawmakers began passing a budget
that
would lower the SUNY increase to $950 while restoring aid
programs
to current levels.
Pataki has vowed to veto their budget and lawmakers are working
at this moment to amass enough votes to override that veto.
All of this sounds like an abstract political battle but there
are very real effects to tuition hikes.
"Need to Know" Alicia Claussell introduces us to
one of the
many students in our area who is sweating out the
negotiations.
>>
Sketch book art class is one of four classes Jose Gonzalez
is taking this semester at SUNY Geneseo.
An average load for the average college student.
But jose works from 8:30 p.m. until 12:30 a.m. at the red
jacket dining hall.
A snack joint on campus.
On the weekends, he does catering work.
That's a total of 25 to 30 hours a week supplementing his
income.
Add that to his full time study load and jose's college life
is
more than average.
It's hectic.
For many young people like jose who come from low income
families, going to college can only happen if that student
also
works part time.
And as jose has found, it can only happen with an affordable
tuition such as they have at all state university of New York's
schools.
>>
I was like I'm not going to pass up an opportunity to go to
an
ivy league SUNY.
Pretty much it was the money.
Add to my list first choice in Connecticut, they wanted $20,000
outside of their loans and their grants and I was like I can't
do it.
>>
now a cash strapped New York state is looking to fill a
budget gap in part by raising SUNY tuition.
Governor Pataki has proposed increasing tuition by as much
as
$1400, a 41% jump bringing its annual tuition from $3400 to
$4800.
An increase Jose Gonzalez just can't afford.
>>
I don't know your situation.
You don't know my situation.
I know that $3400 is just too much for me.
>>
In addition, Pataki is looking into deferring aid from the
tuition assistance program or better known as tap and
eliminating the educational opportunity program which helps
defray costs for textbooks and other educational services.
>>
That's going to hurt.
My God.
I've got a lot from them.
They cut that by 20%, 30%, then they're thinking about cutting
another 50%.
That means I got no money.
I'm in debt a lot longer than I would have to be.
And I just think -- I think it's ridiculous, all of the cuts.
>>
Assemblyman Joseph Morelle sits on the high education
committee.
He says the governor's proposed tuition hikes and cuts will
make it difficult for families to save for college.
>>
When you begin to plan your child's education or an
individual plans for his or her own education, you factor
into
it what the cost of tuition is.
If there's a sudden and very significant increase in tuition,
it makes it very, very difficult to plan.
So at particularly a time when the governor is also proposed
taking 2/3 of the tuition assistance benefits and deferring
that
benefit until a student graduates from school so you're saying
we're going to require you to pay more tuition, we're going
to
give you far less assistance based on need than we have in
the
past and it is very difficult to get student loans.
>>
Jose says the size of the increase is what hurts.
>>
I think it's too high.
I don't think it should be a one shot.
That will really hurt.
Then it's going to keep on going up anyway.
I think it will be easier for students like me if it's
progressive.
>>
There hasn't been an increase in SUNY tuition in seven
years.
New York state senator Joseph Robach says that's because of
Albany's desire to keep the tuition affordable.
Joseph Robach realizes this budget is a challenge because
of
9-11.
A loss of jobs and a slowed down economy.
Joseph Robach perceives other economic repercussions of slow
school enrollment if they don't come to a compromise.
>>
I could tell you that the academic field is a huge employer
for our area.
When you take Brockport, Geneseo, ncc, 35,000 students, big
faculty, u of r, R.I.T., hobart, Nazareth, St. John's fisher,
there's a lot of activity, a lot of economic regions.
If we diminish the amount of people via financial aid packages
going to those universities and schools, that will not only
be
bad for the students, bad for us here in the Rochester area
economically.
>>
SUNY is still a bargain.
But the whole reason is to have affordability and access for
any child who wants to go to higher education.
And the university of Rochester is an outstanding educational
institution but not every student can afford to go to the
university of Rochester and we cannot say to the young people
in this state that if you can't afford to go to a university
of
Rochester or if you can't afford to go to Harvard or New York
university, that you can't go to college at all.
>>
It's the worry that Jose Gonzalez carries with him as state
lawmakers debate the budget.
>>
There's an increase.
I'm pretty much thinking I would have to drop off.
I couldn't afford to continue the education.
>>
Thanks.
I want you to keep in mind that as of the shaping of this
program which was Thursday, the legislature is working to
try
to restore some of the programs and trying to reduce the
tuition increase.
So everything is in flux at this moment.
No issue has driven a wedge between the governor's office
and
the state legislature than the cut in state aid to school
districts.
Suburban school districts who must prepare budgets to take
to
the voting public feared that the governor's cut of about
9% in
state aid would have meant massive property tax hikes.
It appears that legislators are going to restore most of the
state
aid but not all which might make suburban educators breathe
a
little easier but the budget guessing game, something they've
dealt with for nearly two decades of late state budgets is
still part of the equation.
This year, the problems of this system have come to the --
come
to a head with Fairport central school threatening to withhold
the budget until the state passes one of their own.
Meanwhile, state lawmakers this week agreed to give suburban
school districts more time to fashion a budget, overriding
governor Pataki's veto of a bill to extend the deadline for
two weeks.
"Need to Know" Matt Cummings got an earful from
four area
superintendents.
Earlier this week
he began his conversations by asking administrators how are
they planning for the school budget as state lawmakers and
the
governor's battle over the state budget?
>>
I think the -- and the answer to that is until we actually
have a secondhand, we're not counting on anything so our budget
is based on the governor's proposal.
Even if we get some state aid runs late today and tomorrow,
that's only what the legislature has done thus far and until
we know what the final process is and there's a budget in
place, we're not counting on anything.
>>
The lesson that we learned was two years ago here when the
bare bones budget debacle played out was that we can't count
on
those promises.
And so we're going forward planning on using the governor's
numbers and it has a higher than desirable tax impact.
We're looking at a 1.25% budget to budget increase in
expenditures, 1.25 and we're looking at a potential 8.89%
tax
levee impact.
Three years ago, I would have guessed at a number other than
the governor's and I have used it as an estimate.
The last couple of years have been such that I don't dare
do
that again.
>>
If any school district was really concerned about what type
of money it was going to get from the state, you could always
use
the governor's numbers in your planning.
The problem is the governor's numbers contained a huge cut
and
the result of that was quite ugly to schools.
So really the process really hasn't changed.
It's how to react to that and obviously what we've done is
we've restored some of the governor's numbers because we just
found the cuts unacceptable.
I mean, the governor speaks about raising jobs, killing taxes,
essentially what's going on at least here in east Rochester
is
that we are raising taxes and we're cutting jobs at the same
time so the net effect is we're going to increase our tax
levee
which the governor says kills jobs but we’re eliminating
jobs
so I guess the real story is schools have to tighten their
belt
a bit.
>>
What would you want to see changed in Albany when
determining school aid?
>>
The state aid formula is broken.
Everybody recognizes it's far too complicated.
Everybody recognizes that it proportions money in an inequitable
fashion and we really need to reform that formula.
I mentioned that there are a couple of court cases that are
out
there, including the grace lawsuit raised here in Rochester
and
the C.F.E. lawsuit raised in New York city.
Both of those are going to call into question the constitutionality
of the formula for state aid.
I think the best thing that could happen is for the state
to
lose that lawsuit, both lawsuits and for the legislature to
be compelled to take a good, hard look at providing a fair,
equitable, predictable school aid formula that guarantees
all
children in the state of New York are going to have access
to a
quality education no matter where they live.
>>
Actually, I've heard a little bit about what Joseph Morelle
is proposing and he's proposing two things.
Change the fiscal year which I think makes a lot of sense.
They would have to tweak the dates a little bit to make it
work
but I think that would be a good thing.
It would be certainly better for the process if the legislature
and the governor could agree on revenue.
And then Joe also proposed possibly doing budgets two years
in
advance and I think that's a good idea.
>>
You need to have a budget passed by April 1.
There's nothing bad about the process except that it just
doesn't get done on time.
If we had that revenue, if we had an exact amount of money
as
of April 1, we would know what it means for our budgets and
we
could do what we need to do.
>>
You obviously had to decide whether or not to pursue in your
own district what Mr. Taylor is doing in his and I'm sure
there
are questions from taxpayers and parents and students who
decide whether you were going to pursue something like that.
What was your reasoning in deciding not to go that route?
>>
It could look like one of two things.
It could look like a highly principled, thoughtful protest
or
it could look like adolescent pouting and the law says that
there's a common vote date and obviously as a superintendent
of
schools, I think it would be inappropriate for me to advocate
breaking the law.
There's a concern about the repercussions that it might pose
to
the school district itself.
Aside from the obvious, you know, threats that have been
forthcoming from the late education department doing their
job
about removal and that type of thing, I think there's a very
real concern that you would invalidate the results of a vote
when you did hold it if it were not done in a timely and
appropriate fashion.
It's so easy to say our job is to uphold the law.
Yes, our job is to uphold the law.
When does our job look a little different?
When the law is immoral.
In this case it most certainly is and it's not just a one
time
occurrence.
19 straight years.
No student in our school is old enough to experience a budget
that has been passed on time.
>>
Thanks.
In studio with us to continue the discussion, we have Jack
Casement, Brockport central teacher and official in that
district's teacher union;
Jody Siegle, executive director of the school boards association;
Alan
Shank, former professor and
still an active member of the union of university professions.
Thank you for coming.
Let me ask you right off the bat, the Fairport school
district, did they do the right thing here?
Have they made a statement here?
>>
They've certainly made a statement and their statement has
began validated by public feeling from the frustration in
Albany.
Their board, and it is their board that originated this action,
has passed a resolution that truly caught the attention of
the
legislators in Albany.
When we were in Albany during march, everyone we met with
brought up the topic and even though they -- our legislators
stressed dismay that a district would be moved to civil
disobedience if they don't pass the state budget on time,
at
the same time they said Fairport's reactions made them
understand the impact of the delay.
>>
It's been 19 years.
We assume the same thing going on for 19 years.
What should make anybody think we're going to say anything
different this time around after this?
>>
I think this year, we're seeing the legislators respond with
a true indication that they understand the relationship between
their actions and what happens in school districts.
The very fact they override the governor's veto and are
determined to continue to do that and provide more funding
for
education and willing to alter the time lines says that they're
finally realizing that it's not just the school board members
who were complaining but it's affecting people in their
communities and they're making a statement about their values
and what they see is the role of the state.
We'll see if they carry it forward.
>>
As of the taping of this program which was Thursday, we have
seen the legislature move to try to reduce the cut to the
schools
so we should say, hey, great.
No more problem here, right?
>>
No.
No.
The problem is rooted in the whole system of creating a budget
and passing it.
>>
So back to bill Taylor’s situation, aren't we?
>>
We're back to a question of what about when we're at the
same time on the calendar next year?
I would like to see a state budget for two years instead of
one
year.
It would resolve some problem.
But if we're not going to have that, even if we are, our
lawmakers have responsibility to come up with a budget on
time.
You know, instead of dodging the due date, they have personal
responsibility in the future, which they've Dodged for 19
years, to just stop.
And that's what the political pressure is about.
They have stepped up and done the right thing by reinstating
moneys for public education.
And that we're very pleased about.
>>
But from the parents, so far they've -- you know, everybody
threatens and finally we get the money that we need.
Why should I worry about how they're getting to that point?
Really we get what we want, don't we?
>>
No.
We don't always get what we want.
Why is it there's always people fussing over dollars?
For education?
The whole process is dysfunctional and broken.
The teachers, my colleagues and I know a lot of parents are
past anger.
They're in a different dimension of emotion.
They're past anger.
My students don't want to follow any politics as career
choices.
They're not interested in becoming elected officials.
To them the word politician or elected official or working
for
government out of public service is a dirty word.
>>
You are a political science professor.
You could probably comment on that.
>>
Yes, I can.
In fact, I gave a talk on this a couple of weeks ago about
why
young people don't vote and don't participate in the American
political system and I would like to say a couple of words
about the proposed tuition hikes.
>>
Yes.
Absolutely.
>>
I feel very strongly as does united university professions
that SUNY really needs a rational tuition policy.
Which it has never had.
In other words, perhaps more increases over a number of years
and not hit our students with over $1,000 increase in a single
year.
>>
The young man who spoke said that very thing.
He said, I could maybe have taken something gradual but getting
slammed like this in one year is a whole different ballgame.
Would you have said that the last seven years the legislature
made a mistake in not having a gradual increase over the seven
years?
>>
No.
I would blame the governor.
This is an executive decision, not a legislative decision.
The governor and SUNY should look at the SUNY budget in a
comprehensive manner and figure out what are the costs and
what
are the expenses and where is the revenue coming from?
>>
Right.
>>
Instead of hitting SUNY every single year with massive
budget reductions ranging from $50 to $100 million, it doesn't
make any sense to me especially when education, particularly
in
this area which was also mentioned earlier is such a -- an
important part of our local and regional economy.
>>
As a political science professor, do you see any hope for
reforming what we've been seeing for almost two decades?
>>
I'm very pessimistic because SUNY in particular is looked
at
as a state agency and not as a priority.
In New York state.
SUNY does have a huge budget.
It's over $2 million, $2 billion and every time the state
is in
fiscal trouble, the state university of New York is one of
the
first agencies to be hit with massive budget cuts.
And actually the proposed tuition hikes this time, what we're
doing is we're asking students, we're trying to balance the
SUNY budget on the backs of our students rather than getting
more state aid for a very important function in our state.
>>
We've got that -- going back to the school districts, we've
got
an override of the governor's veto on a bill that gives two
extra weeks for school districts to prepare and put out their
budgets.
Is that meaningful in any way?
>>
It's hard --
>>
Or is it just a sign?
>>
It may be a sign.
It's hard to tell.
Certainly the fact that the date has been delayed and that
the
legislature is working would suggest that there will be more
money for education.
But the process isn't completed yet.
When the state legislature finishes their work, they have
to
send their product back to the governor who has said he will
veto it.
He could take as long as 10 days to veto it and send it back
to
the legislature again where they might choose to override
it or
might not but it means that it could take almost this whole
two
weeks before the school districts would know if there are
any
different numbers for them to be looking at besides the
governor's.
And school districts have to complete their budget work.
This past Monday was the first deadline for them to all file
what -- what's called the property tax report card but they
need to finish their budgets for that.
If they're going to alter things, they're going to need to
know
what numbers to work with.
And they have to let their communities know.
It isn't as if the state legislature can just take action
and
immediately everything changes in the districts.
Words have to meet, decisions have to be made.
Information has to be published so whether or not these two
weeks will be enough for the districts to make the substantial
change in how they're formulating the budgets remains to be
seen.
>>
Mr. Casement, you and I believe Mr. Shank will be going to
Albany this weekend.
Would you please tell us what is going to happen there and
how
it might affect what's going on with this argument between
the
legislature and the executive office?
>>
It's 30,000 people that are going to participate in this
march and the march is not the initiative of just one group.
This is a community based initiative, a grassroots effort.
Students, teachers, parents, school employees, school board
members, everyone and everyone who wants to share in a common
voice to be heard saying this, this state must use the
legislature to properly fund education in the future.
Period.
No more excuses.
No more dodging due dates.
Just do it.
Do the right thing.
Yes, it's exciting.
And if you think about the historic meaning of it, we've just
had the governor's position overridden by the legislature
and
as unanimous vote in the senate, it's something to think of.
>>
I want to thank you all for dropping by and being with us
and we want your comments to be a part of this conversation.
Give them to us either on the web at www.WXXI.org/ntk or by
email at Needtoknow@wxxi.org.
Normally at this time we would be going to our business section
with the Democrat and Chronicle but tonight that will give
way
to another story on education from our other collaborative
partner.
News source 13's Kathy Kriz will give us a look at
prekindergarten, a program that appeared to be on the budget
chopping block but is being spared at this moment by
legislators.
>>
And the duck sat on the egg for a long time and pretty soon,
something happened.
The egg cracked.
>>
I knew it.
>>
Most of these children go to universal pre-k five days a week
in the rush Henrietta school district.
Moms and dads are required to participate in a weekly parenting
activity for state grant money to come through.
One option is this class.
The scene this time, eggs.
The children hear a story.
Count eggs in a nest and create their own egg art.
Little Tracy is Terry Almekinder's second child enrolled in
Pre-k.
>>
Kids can read when they come out of kindergarten and Tracy
is learning words and she knows all of her letters now and
I
don't think in preschool we did that.
>>
There's also a class for the parents taught by a retired
kindergarten teacher.
The lesson tonight, introducing early math at home with play
money and coin stamps.
>>
We used to have stores and the house keeping corner and half
the children make their own money for the cash registers.
>>
Rush Henrietta doesn't have any proof universal's pre-k gives
students an advantage but this year program leaders will seek
results from early graduates now in elementary school.
>>
Our first group will be fourth graders.
And we'll be hitting the state standardized tests so we're
going to work with the district on looking at how they do
on
some of those exams and --
>>
This program is in just a handful of school districts in our
area.
Once a child enters kindergarten the doors open to all parents
who want to get involved in their child's education.
>>
When he comes home I ask him three questions.
Something he learned about today, tell me something you liked
about your day and tell me something you might not have liked
about your day.
>>
Judy Flores volunteers at her son's school as does
another mom, Joanne Raleigh.
>>
I learn that he's very much different here than at home.
Totally different which is great.
>>
They're hiding eggs for a holiday party as their boy's
teacher reads her students a story.
>>
It's so important for parents to be involved because not
only do their children see that they care about their
education, but they get to know what is going on in the
classroom.
>>
Anna Hammond connects with her students' parents through
email, progress reports and a monthly newsletter that features
upcoming events.
>>
This is going to be what it looks like, daddy.
>>
events like a holiday party where parents are invited to
help their children build on what's being taught in class.
Together, teachers and parents can work as partners as a child
begins the journey toward graduation.
I'm
news source 13's Kathy Kriz.
>>
Thank you, Kathy.
The
fighting for Rochester's future collaborative returns later
this month with a look at health care.
donations.
We'll let you know on our next program.
[Captioning Made Possible by the U.S. Department of Education]