>>
JUST AHEAD ON "NEED TO KNOW" -- it's a busy one.-
We'll look at how old state labor laws may be costing the
construction industry jobs.-
Some are calling for reforms, but that would take away an
injured worker's ability to get back fair compensation?-
Also, we talk to a local Muslim leader to find out if the
climate of war is causing a backlash.-
We visit the George Eastman house, which is documents the
Chinese-American experience.-
And we have the THE BUSINESS SECTION FOR THE "DEMOCRAT AND
CHRONICLE" all next on "NEED TO KNOW."-
-
>> We are holding owners of property and general contractors
on
job sites with no actual control over employees of
subcontractors.-
We're making them responsible for any injuries that are
incurred by them whether or not they actually had anything to
do with it.-
[CAPTIONING MADE POSSIBLE BY THE U.S. DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION]
Captioned by the National-
Captioning Institute-
--www.ncicap.org-- -
>> Thanks for joining us.-
I'm MICHAEL CAPUTO.-
A look at the debate over New York's labor laws and
construction jobs is coming up.-
But first, mark has forever been known as a great melting pot,
a place where people from across the globe can live and
prosper.-
So when you come from, or are descendents from, a people whose
region is at war with the United States, there's always the
possibility of prejudice.-
With the Iraqi war now under way, "NEED TO KNOW's" MATT
CUMMINGS talked with Dr. Muhammed Shafiq, executive director of
the Islamic center of Rochester.-
He first asked Dr. Shafiq if he has noticed any incidents in
recent days.-
-
>> From 9/11, there had been a lot of hurt.-
You could hear voices outside of the Islamic places, get out of
here, and a lot of phone calls with came to the center.-
Since 9/11, as you see, this community has done a lot of
outreach work.-
This time, there is not too much threats which are coming so
far.-
However, there are a few days before I received one call, and
even this morning I received a call.-
It was not a real threat, but saying, you guys -- what you
doing here in America?-
Why you are having Islamic mosques in America?-
You should get out from this country, sort of that calls are
coming.-
-
>> During this time of war, how have you prepared for possible
threats from members of this community?-
-
>> The Muslim community, as I said, we are doing a lot of
outreach community effort, lot of outreach activities.-
I think this is very important.-
Once we know one another, once we understand one another as a
human being, as together fellow citizens of this country, we
will appreciate one another's existence.-
So, that is being one of the tasks of the Islamic center and
other areas.-
We are putting a lot of programs, a lot of charity program, a
lot of -- in other words, educational programs which we are
putting together so that diversity of religion and races can be
appreciated.-
That's one of the tasks which we are doing.-
On the other hand, we are certainly taking precautions of
security also.-
An example, we talked to the Brighton police, and thanks to the
chief of Brighton police, you may see it around, giving us
security.-
Plus we have our own security to make sure that risks will be
minimized.-
-
>> The U.S. department of homeland security says registering
adult males from many different Muslim nations will help
improve national security.-
Do you agree with that statement?-
-
>> Well, you know, this is something which could be -- which
we
can talk about.-
We do not feel comfortable with this registration of I.N.S.-
We feel that it is sort of profing -- profiling.-
There are people among all immigrants who have come to this
country.-
Remember, people are always there in each and every society, in
each and every community, whether it's the religious community
or a nonreligious community, so all those immigrants which have
come to this country, there are very good people among them,
but there could be wrong people among them also.-
Similarly, we have people that have been living here a long,
long time but there are good and wrong people among them too.-
We as Muslims feel it is very wrong to pick only Muslims.-
It should have made all immigrants who have come to this
country who are noncitizens and -- in other words, who have
come for work or whatever reasons they have come here, go
through this registration.-
Then I think Muslims would not feel it.-
At this time, Muslims feel they have been picked out and
singled out and this is racial profiling.-
-
>> In the past you have called Rochester a city unique for
its
interfaith understanding.-
Is that holding true during this time of war?-
-
>> I think it's holding very true.-
In the future you are having other activities, not only that we
are increasing our activities with the Jewish community.-
Very soon I think you will see that we will have a mutual
agreement of understanding in the ethnic communities that will
be fine.-
So, there are more activities coming up, and I think these
activities are a blessing for the city of Rochester and these
are -- these are such activities which are very essential for
harmony, and any community you can get this I think is best.-
-
>> In the last year and a half, war on terror, and now the
war
in Iraq, have affected immigrants to this country -- war, the
dipping economy, these are forces out of anyone's control.-
But this past week, small business owners and builders went to
Albany to argue for something they believe can be changed --
reforming state law they say has hiked premiums on construction
projects by as much as 300% over the last few years.-
They claim these high insurance premiums have forced carriers
to stop underwriting New York construction firms.-
That limits the availability of insurance, and that costs the
industry jobs.-
Builders and insurance brokers say the culprit is a set of old
New York State labor laws that place absolute liability on the
contractors and owners when an employee is injured on the
jobs.-
Similar calls for reform in the past have fallen on deaf ears.-
Attorneys say these labor laws allow for just compensation to
laborers who suffer severe injury.-
Builders and insurers, however, say the antiquated laws are
pushing the industry to the brink of crisis.-
With more on this is, again, "NEED TO KNOW's" MATT CUMMINGS.-
-
>> Yep.-
-
>> By biggest fear is I won't be able to get insurance,
I mean,
we'd be out of business.-
-
>> Vic Salerno worries that rising insurance premiums will
mean
layoffs for workers at his electrical contracting company.-
-
>> We would have to lay off hundreds of workers, all the
people
in the office.-
I mean, can you imagine if that was allowed to happen?-
-
>> Salerno's concern is shared by many in Rochester's
construction and insurance industries, along with some in the
state legislature.-
The focus is on sections 240 and 241 of New York's labor law,
commonly referred to as the "safe place to work law"
or the
"scaffolding law."-
These sections are interpreted by the courts to establish an
absolute liability standard on all New York State contractors
or property owners.-
Any accidental injury an employee may suffer.-
This is over and above any workers' compensation benefit for
which the worker may be eligible.-
Salerno says that absolute liability cripples area
contractors.-
-
>> It's been a terrible burden on many contractors, in fact,
some have even -- haven't been able to get insurance and have
been forced to go out of business.-
-
>> Salerno says his insurance premiums are up almost 300%
over
the last three years.-
John Costello, a lokeloke -- local insurance agent and chair of
a statewide insurance association, says the absolute liability
clause faces firms to make tough choices.-
-
>> A certain contractor who has very good safety record
and
safety procedures, written documentation on how things must be
done, are still being held liable even though they had nothing
to do with these injuries.-
That makes insurance companies very nervous, so in the short
term, insurance companies have decided we don't want to write
business for contractors given the way the rules are set up.-
We can't underwrite and say a quality contractor can avoid
these issues.-
If somebody slips and falls on your job site, even though you
had nothing to do with it, you are responsible.-
It's just not an acceptable thing for the insurance companies.-
-
>> Costello says while the scaffolding law has been in place
for many years, it was a court case in the 1980's that altered
the scope of the labor laws.-
-
>> Prior to that court case, there had to be some negligence
on
somebody's part that caused or contributed to the injury.-
This absolute liability ruling took all that away and created
the situation where, even though you didn't do anything to
create injury, couldn't have done anything to prevent the
injury, the fact that the injury occurred makes you
responsible.-
And I think that when you talk to most reasonable people, they
say, how can that be?-
You're creating a class of citizens, owners, and contractors,
that can't defend themselves.-
-
>> Costello and Salerno say firms in Pennsylvania and Ohio
who
don't have to adhere to the absolute liability standard.-
They're winning contracts by underbidding New York's firms.-
They say this puts local contractors and jobs at risk.-
State assemblyman Joseph MORELLE has authored legislation that
would reform these labor laws.-
He says the current system creates a trickle-down effect that
lands the additional insurance costs at the feet of business
and homeowners.-
-
>> What you'll see is fewer contractors because there will
be
fewer insurers in the marketplace insuring them, so when there
are fewer contractors, there's a greater demand on the fewer
contractors left behind, which means they can pick and choose
on projects.-
They isle pass that cost on to customers if you can or whoever
has hired them to do a project.-
You'll see an increase in the cost of doing business which will
have a dill tearious effect on the economy.-
And you'll see more people out of work.-
-
>> For Salerno, the key is being able to defend his business.-
-
>> You know, either repeal the thing outright like every
other
state has done except New York or at least amend it because the
contractors have no defense and it's costing everybody out
there if somebody gets hurt.-
You have no defense.-
That's how bizarre this is.-
-
>> Now we'll continue the conversation with our in-studio
guests, John Costello, chairman of the independent insurance
agents association of New York, and Joe Moran, founding partner
of Moran & Kufta, personal injury lawyers.-
Thank you both for coming.-
I want to get right to the point here.-
If you were to change the laws, reform the laws, wouldn't the
costs shift from the industry itself to the taxpayer?-
Because where are you going to go?-
Where is the injured person going to go but to social services,
to workers' comp?-
Won't that shift, Mr. Costello?-
-
>> I don't think we'd basically see a shift.-
What I think we would see is basically workers' compensation
would pay for those particular injuries that would come under
the workers' comp, and if there was some negligence on the part
of a contractor or an owner, we're not saying we're going to
take away any injured worker's right to sue and win if there
was some negligence, but what we're basically saying is we need
a change that basically allows contractors and owners to defend
themselves.-
We don't want to take away anybody's right to sue anybody.-
What we would like to do is reinstate the ability for owners
and contractors to defend themselves.-
-
>> Mr. Moran, the charge has been, the trial lawyers alone
are
standing in the way of reform.-
What would you say to that?-
-
>> I don't think anyone is standing in the way of reform.-
This reform took place 30 years ago in 1962, the legislature
passed a law just like the insurance industry wants to be
passed now, and that law stayed in effect for seven years.-
The laws that exist now came into being in 19 -- 1895.-
We found workers were falling like flies, killed all over the
place.-
Finally the legislature changed it.-
-
>> So, it's been tried once before and you're saying it
didn't
work out because there were more injuries?-
Where's the cause and effect there?-
-
>> Well, if you -- if people are working on construction
sites,
the only way you're going to get the owners an the general
contractors to enforce safety is if you hit them in their
pocketbook if they don't.-
Once you take away the right to force them to do things safely,
they're going to hire the cheapest contractors they can find to
do the work, which is what they did from 1962-69 and cheap
contractors don't enforce the law and people die.-
-
>> Anybody that's made it this far in being a contractor
pretty
much understands that safety is number one.-
We have OSHA, a major safety component, and every contractor
that's doing business right now.-
I think every municipality that does work looks at the
contractor's safety record as one of the prerequisite for
including quality contractors on their jobs.-
So, I would believe that anybody that's still in business today
is concerned about safety and I think it's been proven that
keeping good workers working for you is a lot more beneficial
to you than having slipshod safety practices.-
-
>> Joseph MORELLE and others on the senate side have introduced
that would change the 241 laws.-
But this has come up year in and year out for the last seven
years.-
Why hasn't it changed, would you say?-
-
>> I think you have a certain dynamic with Sheldon silver
being
an attorney, who is the speaker of the house.-
I think the assembly has not been open to really any debate on
this unless pushed to discuss it.-
So, I think you haven't had a leadership that's willing to
discuss the issue at all.-
-
>> Mr. Moran, what would you say to Mr. Costello and Mr.
Joseph
MORELLE saying this as well, this law is prohibiting New York
from competing with construction firms from Pennsylvania and
Ohio, coming in and underbidding?-
Isn't there some room for compromise on this bill, with this
law?-
-
>> That just isn't true.-
Any firm that comes into New York and does business in New York
is bound by this law, so whether they're from Ohio or
Pennsylvania or wherever, they have to comply with New York
laws.-
-
>> I think if they use workers from out of state, they don't
have to, do they?-
-
>> Not that I'm aware of.-
It's like the speeding law.-
If the speed limit is 65, other people from out of state can't
drive 75.-
-
>> We're mixing two different things.-
I think there is a requirement if that if you have somebody
that comes from -- as a matter of fact, we had in Rochester
with the construction of a Lowe's in Greece, you had an Ohio
contractor that came into town and built the Lowe's, ibblet the
rule is as long as he's employeing workers from Ohio, bringing
them with him and they are on the job site six weeks or less,
you can get a waiver of workers' compensation, basically these
are his home crew and he can work here.-
I think that's a situation that occurred.-
There were no New York workers on that job because -- if you
also look at the general liability costs, the costs in Ohio are
probably about 1/3 of what the general liability costs are for
contractors in New York because every job that a New York
contractor for the most part does in New York, he's susceptible
to 240 claims.-
The Ohio contractor has no such problem while he's operating in
Ohio, and his corresponding overhead is much lower, allowing
him to get that job.-
-
>> I have about a minute left.-
I want to talk to the union worker out there.-
First, Mr. Moran, why should the union worker laws not change?-
-
>> Because these are the only laws that create any safety
for
these workers.-
The OSHA regulations do not increase safety at all.-
They don't have enough to.-
The biggest problem is if a worker gets injured on a job and he
has to go to workers' comp.-
The maximum amount of money he can get is $400 a week.-
If he was making $1,000 a week, he's out.-
-
>> Why should the union worker want to see reform?-
-
>> Basically it sees everybody -- serving everybody well
to be
working.-
We're in a position where New York contractors are not
competitive.-
We'll find more and more out-state contractors coming in and
taking jobs from New York worker, and we are willing to do
something to allow the cost be shifted to the people that need
to pay them and it's not necessarily the contractors and owners
that have anything to do with these.-
-
>> Thank you very much.-
We would like your comments.-
There are two ways to give them to us.-
Visit our website by www.wxxi.org/ntk
or send us an e-mail at
needtoknow@wxxi.com.-
NOW
IT'S TIME FOR THIS WEEK'S
EDITION OF "THE BUSINESS
SECTION" WITH THE "THE
DEMOCRAT AND CHRONICLE."
>>
With us is ELLEN ROSEN, business editor for the "DEMOCRAT
AND CHRONICLE."-
Why don't we recap some of the economic news.-
The University of Rochester has been making news here and
around the country.-
Basically it centers on whether -- it's a battle they lost.-
It centers on whether an educational institution can
participate fully, I suppose, in discoveries that are made in
partnership with industry.-
I don't know if I've summed that up right.-
-
>> It's a battle that's temporarily they've had a setback
on.-
They appealed the ruling on the court here to a higher level.-
It centers over intellectual property and whether the
university can -- it has a valid patent for the discovery of
this enzyme, and we've heard a lot about it, drugs like
Celebrex have been developed to combat, pain medication.-
Basically, it had not been discovered that this enzyme was
related to inflation and these drug companies would not have
been able to come in and make these medications.-
Urgent answer to our economy says if the patent were ruled
valid, they would have the patent.-
-
>> The interest, I think, not with just the University of
Rochester but all universities that may be partering, we're
seing this all over the state, the biotech, the partnership
between encase and business.-
-
>> Right.-
-
>> There are ramifications.-
-
>> The court ruled that the U. of R. hadn't discovered the
drug
and they had to take it a step further.-
The institution is arguing they can't afford to take it that
far, their job is to research the science and do you want
universities in the business of developing medications for sale
on the market, but that they ought to be able to share in the
profits of the research as it benefits private companies.-
-
>> Growing pains, I think.-
D & l continuing to be stung by patent infringement cases,
I
think.-
Tell us where we're at.-
-
>> A competing company had already won the case against
it to
prevent pure vision production in the United States, largely
those lenses having been made here, but b & l shipped them
to
waterFord, Ireland.-
The lenses can't be made or sold in the United States but
they're selling them all over Europe and Asia.-
They've sued them in a court in Ireland trying to stop
production in Europe.-
That would in effect kill the product, and this is one of b &
l's bright spots.-
-
>> Over the last few weeks we've seen the unemployment rate
and
so forth in Rochester.-
Where are we at now?-
Manufacturing continues to be soft.-
-
>> Manufacturing continues to slide.-
We're continuing to lose thousands of jobs in manufacturing
which are not being replaced.-
Kodak is expecting more layoffs in the coming year, Xerox,
things like that.-
We're continuing to lose manufacturing job, and they're not
being replaced as rapidly as they had been for a long time.-
That growth is not happening now.-
We're seeing an overall reduction in jobs and our unemployment
continues to crime.-
-
>> Talk a little about what's coming up this Sunday, the
state
of Rochester's economy is the focus of what the "DEMOCRAT
AND
CHRONICLE" is doing this Sunday.-
Talk about that.-
-
>> Well, it's actually the opening section in a series that'll
be going on for several months where we really decided that we
wanted to take a look at the future.-
We're calling it "Fighting for Rochester's Future."-
What we decided to do was rather than layout the problems that
are out there, because they're obvious to a lot of people, an
the laying out and the talking about the problems has been
going on for a long time, we decided to find solutions.-
We'll be looking at the economy, healthcare, education, public
safety, the whole issue of taxation in special sections over
the next few months, and really what we did is we launched a
poll and we're working in collaboration with your station and
WOKR-TV on this project.-
We launched a poll and interviewed citizens of Rochester to
find out their ideas and they're researched all over the
country to find possible solutions for some of the things that
are happening in Rochester's economy.-
-
>> I want to talk about this clabtive we have.-
We'll continue this collaboration on April 3.-
We'll present a live one-hour forum on Rochester's economy
Thursday night at 8:00 p.m. two days after the section comes
out.-
Paychex and three business leaders, including Paetec C.E.O.
Arunis Chesonis, will make their case for Rochester's economic
woes.-
A citizen panel will be on hand to react.-
We invite you to participate by calling us or e-mailing us.-
We'll have those numbers and addresses for you at the end of
this program.-
But before we go, the war on terror, and now the war in Iraq,
have affected immigrants to this country, and to the Rochester
area.-
Many groups over the decades have dealt with the difficulty of
visiting a new land becoming part of the culture while
maintaining their own cultural identity.-
Public broadcasting is focusing on one of those groups --
Chinese-Americans, a three-part series on Chinese-American
history.-
The local Chinese-American community has been engaged in its
past and future.-
Elissa Marra has more on this.-
-
>> "becoming American" project features a website
where you can
tell your own story about becoming American and it's important
to Kai Yee.-
He joined his parents 30 years ago.-
-
>> I came for about two years.-
I went back to Hong Kong and get married with my wife and
applied to have her come over.-
-
>> Kai Yee's journey has been similar to that of other
Chinese-Americans of his generation.-
He was educated here and works here and says the biggest
struggles of the generation before him were the language and
the culture.-
-
>> They would face the challenge of the English language
and as
a result, finding a job, finding a paying job, and those folks
ended up in the labor trade a lot of times, like in the
restaurants, and in laundromats, kind of a thing.-
-
>> With 4,000 Chinese-Americans in Rochester alone, Kai
Yee has
been happy to spread the word, not just about their
accomplishments and about this documentary but about the
importance of understanding the Chinese in Rochester and
understanding that even though younger Chinese-Americans don't
face as many language or cultural barrier, they still
struggle.-
-
>> Not that they're not integrated now, but in certain
businesses, there are still glass ceilings, especially for
business professional.-
The Chinese are known for their technical expertise, engineers,
scientists, all that.-
What I like to see more would be that the glass ceilings will
be broken for major corporations, management ranks.-
-
>> At Rochester's George Eastman house, Terese Mulligan
looks
over a photographic tribute to Chinese-Americans, part of this
project, it honors one of the first Americans to document the
Chinese-American experience.-
-
>> He would be passing by along the street, so you kind
of get
this immediacy in his photography.-
-
>> An exhibit next month will feature works by Steve McCurry.-
-
>> The public began to learn about America via images, and
since that time, the beginning of the 1840's, till today, the
photograph has been the primary tool used for understanding
ourselves and our diversity.-
-
>> The Chinese-American photographs hang in the Eastman
house
north gallery.-
The "becoming American" project features a website where
you
can tell your own story about becoming American.-
It's at www.NYcitizens.org.-
Next week, "NEED TO KNOW" expands for a full hour, "Fighting
for Rochester's Future," our partners the "DEMOCRAT
AND
CHRONICLE" and WOKR-TV.-
We invite your call that evening by dialing 454-6300 or you can
e-mail us at needtoknow@wxxi.com.-
We'll see you then.-
(Music)
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