(Music)
>> Elissa: JUST AHEAD ON "NEED
TO KNOW," APRIL 1st HAS COME AND
GONE, AND THAT MEANS MORE THAN
ANOTHER LATE STATE BUDGET.
NEW YORK'S NURSING HOMES NOW
FACE A NEW REVENUE TAX THAT MANY
SAY WILL HAVE A DRAMATIC EFFECT
ON NEW YORK'S NURSING HOME
INDUSTRY.
PLUS WE'LL BE JOINED BY ELLEN
ROSEN OF THE "DEMOCRAT AND
CHRONICLE" FOR THIS WEEK'S
BUSINESS SEGMENT.
AND WHILE WINTER MAY BE HOLDING
ON, THE GEORGE EASTMAN HOUSE
RECENTLY HELD AN EXHIBIT THAT'S
CERTAIN TO GET YOU IN THE MOOD
FOR SPRING.
IT'S ALL COMING UP NEXT ON "NEED
TO KNOW."
(Music)
>> THERE'S A REAL NEGATIVE
IMPACT ON THE NURSING HOMES IN
THAT THEY'VE BEEN GIVEN MONEY ON
ONE HAND, AND NOW THEY'RE TAKING
IT AWAY.
>> THIS IS "NEED TO KNOW," THE
ROCHESTER AREA'S ONLY IN-DEPTH
NEWS PROGRAM.
"NEED TO KNOW" IS A PRODUCTION
OF WXXI NEWS AND PUBLIC AFFAIRS
COVERING ISSUES, POLITICS,
EDUCATION AND CURRENT EVENTS.
>> "NEED TO KNOW" IS MADE
POSSIBLE BY THE DAISY MARQUIS
JONES FOUNDATION, BY DORSCHEL
LEXUS AND THROUGH THE SUPPORT OF
VIEWERS LIKE YOU.
>> Elissa: THANK YOU FOR
JOINING US.
I'M ELISSA MARRA.
GARY WALKER HAS THE WEEK OFF.
WHILE APRIL 1st HAS MANY PEOPLE
THINKING SPRING, IT HAS STATE
LEGISLATORS THINKING ABOUT
DOLLARS.
AN APRIL 1st STATE BUDGET
DEADLINE HAS COME AND GONE ONCE
AGAIN.
FOR THE 18th CONSECUTIVE YEAR,
NEW YORK HAS FAILED TO PASS ITS
ANNUAL BUDGET ON TIME.
GOVERNOR GEORGE PATAKI PRESENTED
HIS BUDGET FOR LEGISLATIVE
APPROVAL BACK IN JANUARY, AND
JOINING ME IN STUDIO NOW IS WXXI
AM 1370s'S BOB SMITH TO DISCUSS
WHERE THINGS STAND RIGHT NOW.
THEY HAD A BIRTHDAY PARTY FOR
LATE BUDGET BOY, A FICTIONAL
CHARACTER THAT THE GOOD
GOVERNMENT GROUPS CREATED, BOB,
ON APRIL 1st BECAUSE HE'S 18
YEARS OLD NOW.
>> EXACTLY.
THEY NOT ONLY CELEBRATED HIS
BIRTHDAY, BUT THEY REGISTERED
HIM FOR THE DRAFT AND THEY
REGISTERED HIM TO VOTE.
NOW, OBVIOUSLY LATE BUDGET BOY
IS A FICTIONAL CHARACTER.
>> Elissa: BUT THIS IS SERIOUS
BUSINESS.
>> BUT IT IS SERIOUS BUSINESS
BENEATH ALL THE COMEDY.
IT'S A RUEFUL COMEDY CERTAINLY
BECAUSE, 18 YEARS IN A ROW,
DATING BACK TO ONLY THE SECOND
YEAR OF THE CUOMO
ADMINISTRATION, SECOND FULL YEAR
OF IT, SINCE WE HAVE HAD A
BUDGET ACTUALLY PASSED ON TIME.
WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
IT DEPENDS ON WHO YOU TALK TO.
TO THE LEGISLATORS, TO THE
PEOPLE IN GOVERNMENT ITSELF, A
LOT GOES ON BUSINESS AS USUAL.
BUT LOCAL GOVERNMENTS AND LOCAL
SCHOOL DISTRICTS WORRY A LOT,
BECAUSE THE LATER THEY GET WORD
ON HOW MUCH MONEY THEY'RE GOING
TO HAVE TO WORK WITH FROM STATE
COFFERS, THE LATER THEY ARE IN
PUTTING TOGETHER THEIR PLANS FOR
THE COMING YEAR, AND THAT IS A
CRUCIAL DEADLINE.
>> Elissa: IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE
IT SPEEDS UP THE PROCESS THOUGH.
WHAT ARE THE REASONS THAT YOU'RE
HEARING FROM THE LEADERS ABOUT
WHY THIS IS GOING TO TAKE SO
LONG?
EVERY YEAR THEY'RE OPTIMISTIC
THAT IT'S NOT GOING TO TAKE AS
LONG, BUT WHAT ARE YOU HEARING?
WHAT ARE THE REASONS WHY IT'S
GOING TO TAKE SOME TIME?
>> RIGHT NOW IT'S POLITICS AND
IT'S POLITICS OF A DIFFERENT
KIND THAN WE'VE HAD IN PREVIOUS
YEARS.
UP TO NOW, THERE'S BEEN BITTER
DEBATE ABOUT HOW MUCH MONEY THE
STATE WAS ACTUALLY GOING TO HAVE
TO SPEND.
YOU'D HAVE THE GOVERNOR
LOW-BALLING IT, THE STATE SENATE
COMING IN SOMEWHAT HIGHER, THE
ASSEMBLY COMING IN HIGHER STILL,
WITH TRADITIONALLY THE STATE
SENATE NUMBERS BEING PRETTY
CLOSE TO RIGHT.
THIS YEAR, THERE'S VERY LITTLE
DISAGREEMENT OVER HOW MUCH MONEY
IS AVAILABLE.
THEY'RE ALL WITHIN ABOUT A HALF
A BILLION DOLLARS, WHICH IN
CONTEXT OF AN 89-BILLION-DOLLAR
BUDGET, IS NOT MUCH.
>> Elissa: EXACTLY.
>> THAT'S EASY TO BRIDGE THAT
GAP AND SET A COMPROMISE.
THE QUESTION THIS YEAR IS HOW DO
YOU SPEND IT?
HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH COMPETING
NEEDS WHEN YOUR REVENUES AREN'T
RISING VERY FAST ANY LONGER?
>> Elissa: AND THIS WAS A 9/11
ISSUE PARTIALLY?
>> PARTLY IT'S A 9/11 ISSUE.
PARTLY IT'S A RECESSION ISSUE
THAT WAS BUILDING BEFORE
SEPTEMBER 11th, AND THE BOTTOM
LINE IS NOT MUCH MONEY TO
DIVIDE.
HOW DO YOU DIVIDE IT?
>> Elissa: WE HAVE JUST ABOUT A
MINUTE LEFT, BUT I WANT TO
QUICKLY ASK THE MESSAGE OF
NECESSITY BECAUSE THAT'S COME UP
IN SOME OF THE COVERS THAT I'VE
SEEN OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF
WEEKS, THE SENSE THAT LAWMAKERS
WON'T REALLY GET TO READ
EVERYTHING ONCE THEY GET THE
BUDGET IN HAND.
>> IT'S EXACTLY THE SAME THING
THEY DID IN PASSING THAT SUB
BUDGET ON HEALTH CARE THAT
CREATED THE GRANNY TAX THAT
YOU'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT LATER
ON IN THE PROGRAM.
IT'S EXACTLY THE SAME THING.
THE GOVERNOR, OR SOME AUTHORITY,
WILL PUT TOGETHER A PACKAGE, ASK
THE LEGISLATORS TO VOTE ON IT
WITHOUT REALLY GETTING THE
NORMAL LOOK AT IT, AND THEN ONLY
LATER, AFTER THEY'VE PASSED IT,
WILL THEY FIND OUT WHAT THEY
VOTED FOR.
>> Elissa: OKAY.
AND THE NEXT ACTION, NOT MUCH
ACTION REALLY UNTIL NEXT WEEK
NOW, RIGHT?
>> APRIL 8th IS THE EARLIEST
ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN BECAUSE
THAT'S WHEN EVERYBODY COMES BACK
FROM THE HOLIDAY, EASTER AND
PASSOVER VACATION AND BEGINS TO
WORK AGAIN.
THE FINAL END DATE, WHO KNOWS?
>> Elissa: ALL RIGHT, THANKS.
BOB SMITH FROM AM 1370
CONNECTION.
WE WILL BE LISTENING FOR FURTHER
UPDATES ON WXXI AM 1370.
AND NOW WE TURN OUR ATTENTION TO
THAT NEW STATE HEALTH BILL THAT
WENT INTO EFFECT THIS WEEK.
IT'S CALLED THE HEALTH CARE WORK
FORCE, RECRUITMENT AND RETENTION
ACT.
IT'S PART OF A
3-AND-A-HALF-BILLION-DOLLAR
HEALTH PACKAGE THAT INCLUDES
$1.8 BILLION FOR HOSPITALS,
NURSING HOMES AND OTHER HEALTH
CARE AGENCIES TO RECRUIT AND
RETAIN SKILLED WORKERS.
HOWEVER, INCLUDED IN THAT
LEGISLATION IS A 6% TAX ON ALL
NURSING HOME REVENUE TO GO
TOWARD THE STATE'S GENERAL FUND.
DUBBED "THE GRANNY TAX," NURSING
HOME ADMINISTRATORS SAY THEY
HAVE NO CHOICE NOW BUT TO PASS
ALONG THE TAX TO THEIR PRIVATE
PAY RESIDENTS, RAISING THEIR
ANNUAL RESIDENCE BILLS THEY SAY
BY AN AVERAGE OF $5,000.
WHILE AREA HOSPITALS WILL
BENEFIT FROM THE NEW $18 MILLION
THEY'LL RECEIVE AS PART OF THE
PLAN, OPPONENTS SAY IT COULD
CREATE A LABOR WAR AMONG HEALTH
CARE AGENCIES FOR QUALIFIED
WORKERS, AND IN THE END THEY SAY
IT COULD LOWER THE QUALITY OF
CARE FOR NURSING HOME RESIDENTS.
TONIGHT WE HAVE THE CHAIRMAN OF
THE ROCHESTER AREA ASSOCIATION
OF HOMES AND SERVICES FOR THE
AGING WITH US TO DISCUSS THE
TOPIC.
BUT FIRST WE HAVE "NEED TO
KNOW'S" MATT CUMMINGS.
HE IS GOING TO OUTLINE HOW
NURSING HOMES SAY THEY WILL BE
IMPACTED BY THIS NEW TAX.
>> HE TRIED ALL MORNING.
I WOULDN'T LET HIM GET ME.
>> Matt: CHARLIE RUNION
RECOGNIZES AMERICA IS GETTING
OLDER AND MAKES IT HIS BUSINESS
TO KNOW THE NEEDS OF NURSING
HOME RESIDENTS.
AS THE PRESIDENT AND C.E.O. OF
St. JOHN'S HOME FOR THE PAST
NINE YEARS, HE HAS SEEN THE COST
OF PROVIDING QUALITY CARE TO
NURSING HOME RESIDENTS
SKYROCKET, WHICH MAKES THE
RECENT PASSING OF THE HEALTH
CARE WORK FORCE RECRUITMENT AND
RETENTION ACT SO DIFFICULT FOR
HIM TO UNDERSTAND.
UNDER THE LEGISLATION, ALL NEW
YORK STATE NURSING HOMES ARE NOW
REQUIRED TO PAY A 6% TAX ON ALL
REVENUE.
RUNION SUPPORTS THE GOAL OF THE
LAW, BUT SAYS HOW IT IS FUNDED
MAKES NO SENSE.
>> THE PROBLEM IS THAT, IN
MONROE COUNTY, WE WILL BE
RECEIVING $11 MILLION IN
RECRUITMENT RETENTION MONEY; BUT
WE WILL BE SENDING IN, IN 6%
ASSESSMENT TAX, $22 MILLION.
>> Matt: RUNION SAYS THE STATE
IS GIVING MONEY TO NURSING HOMES
WITH ONE HAND AND TAKING IT BACK
WITH ANOTHER, ALL WHILE PLACING
A FINANCIAL BURDEN ON THE WRONG
PEOPLE.
>> IF THEY PUT THE BURDEN ON
THOSE PEOPLE WHO ARE ALREADY
DOING THE RIGHT THING, THOSE
PEOPLE WHO SAVED THEIR MONEY;
THEY'RE PAYING FOR THEIR CARE
HERE.
OUR PRIVATE PAY RATES RIGHT NOW
ARE $90 HIGHER THAN OUR MEDICAID
RATES, AND THAT'S BECAUSE OUR
MEDICAID RATES ARE $50 A DAY
LOWER THAN OUR COST.
SO THOSE PRIVATE PAY RESIDENTS
ARE ALREADY SUBSIDIZING THE
MEDICAID SYSTEM.
NOW THEY'RE BEING ASKED TO
SUBSIDIZE IT BY $15 A DAY MORE.
>> Matt: IT'S LOOKING WITHIN THE
NUMBERS THAT RUNION SAYS ONE CAN
SEE HOW DISPROPORTIONATELY THE
TAX TARGETS NURSING HOMES AND
THEIR RESIDENCES.
HE SAYS, BEYOND HAVING TO CHARGE
PRIVATE PAY RESIDENTS MORE TO
COVER LOW MEDICARE REIMBURSEMENT
RATES, St. JOHN'S WILL PAY OVER
$880,000 IN TAXES OVER THE NEXT
36 MONTHS FOR MEDICARE, PRIVATE
INSURANCE, BEAUTY SHOP AND
CAFETERIA REVENUE THAT IS NOT
REIMBURSABLE.
St. JOHN'S WILL SEND $6.3
MILLION OVER THE NEXT THREE
YEARS TO NEW YORK STATE IN TOTAL
AS PART OF THE 6% TAX.
RUNION SAYS THE STATE WILL GET
OFF CHEAPLY IN THE PLAN AS IT
ONLY PAYS 40 CENTS OF EVERY
DOLLAR St. JOHN'S IS REIMBURSED
FOR MEDICAID RESIDENTS.
10 CENTS COMES FROM THE COUNTY
AND 50 CENTS FROM THE FEDERAL
GOVERNMENT, MEANING THAT, OF THE
$6.3 MILLION St. JOHN'S WILL
SEND IN, NEW YORK STATE WILL
HAVE TO REIMBURSE THEM ONLY $1.2
MILLION, NETTING JUST OVER $5
MILLION.
>> THE FIRST IMPACT IS MY
PRIVATE PAY POPULATION WILL BE
PAYING ABOUT $6,000 A YEAR MORE
TO LIVE HERE AT St. JOHN'S.
THE LONGER TERM PROBLEM THAT I
SEE WITH THIS IS THAT I THINK IT
REALLY DISCOURAGES PEOPLE FROM
DOING THE RIGHT THING.
IT DISCOURAGES PEOPLE FROM
SAVING THE MONEY AND PAYING FOR
THEIR HEALTH CARE NEEDS WHEN
THEY BECOME IN NEED OF A NURSING
HOME.
IF PEOPLE CONVERT AND TRANSFER
THEIR ASSETS AND GO ON MEDICAID,
IF I HAD A 100-PERCENT MEDICAID
POPULATION RIGHT NOW, THAT WOULD
COST $8.5 MILLION MORE TO THE
MEDICAID SYSTEM.
>> Matt: RUNION SAYS MORE
RESIDENTS ARE SPENDING DOWN
THEIR ASSETS OR TRANSFERRING
THEIR WEALTH TO FAMILY MEMBERS
TO BECOME ELIGIBLE TO HAVE
MEDICAID PAY FOR THEIR NURSING
HOME CARE.
HE BELIEVES THE COMBINATION OF
FEWER PRIVATE PAY RESIDENTS AND
LAGGING MEDICAID REIMBURSEMENTS
RATES IS SETTING THE SCENE FOR
DISASTER.
>> WHAT HAPPENS THEN IS THERE'S
A CRISIS, AND THERE IS THIS
LOOMING ICEBERG EFFECT HAPPENING
IN NEW YORK; AND THE REASON IS,
SINCE 1983, THE HEALTH CARE
POLICY FOR DEALING WITH SENIORS
HAS GONE BUDGET TO BUDGET.
THERE'S NO LONG-TERM VISION
COMING OUT OF THE DEPARTMENT OF
HEALTH AS TO HOW THEY WANT TO
DEAL WITH THE CRISIS THAT'S
LOOMING, AND THE PROBLEM IS THAT
OUR REIMBURSEMENT SYSTEM IS
BASED ON 1983 COSTS.
>> Matt: 1983 COSTS THAT DON'T
FACTOR IN St. JOHN'S $200,000
INCREASE IN PROPERTY AND
INSURANCE PREMIUMS THIS YEAR AND
RISING PHARMACY AND LABOR COSTS.
DIANE ASHLEY IS THE EXECUTIVE
VICE PRESIDENT OF ROCHESTER
REGIONAL HEALTH CARE ADVOCATES.
SHE REPRESENTS AREA HOSPITALS
AND NURSING HOMES IN ALBANY.
SHE IS CONCERNED THE TAX WILL
NOT ALLOW NURSING HOMES TO
RECRUIT AND RETAIN THE SKILLED
WORKERS NEEDED TO PROVIDE
QUALITY CARE.
>> WHAT HAS HAPPENED WITH THIS,
THEY'VE ALSO GIVEN AN INCREASE
TO THE HOSPITALS AND OTHER
HEALTH CARE PROVIDERS ACROSS THE
STATE, WHICH IS GOING TO CAUSE A
BATTLE BETWEEN WHERE THESE
EMPLOYEES ARE GOING TO GO.
IT'S GOING TO BE EASIER FOR
PEOPLE THAT CAN PAY MORE TO HIRE
THESE PEOPLE THAN IT IS FOR THE
NURSING HOMES WHO ARE NOT GOING
TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO RECRUIT
AND RETAIN THE TYPES OF
EMPLOYEES THAT THEY NEED TO TAKE
CARE OF PATIENTS.
SO WHERE MAYBE BEFORE, YOUR
GRANDMOTHER OR YOUR MOTHER OR
YOUR FATHER GOT ATTENTION THREE,
FOUR OR FIVE TIMES A DAY, THEY
MIGHT NOT BE ABLE TO GET AS MUCH
ATTENTION AS THEY NEED TO HELP
THEM WITH THEIR DRESSING OR
FEEDING AND OTHER THINGS, SO
THERE ARE ISSUES OF DAILY
LIVING.
>> Matt: RUNION SAYS THE 6% TAX
IS ALSO AN UPSTATE/DOWNSTATE
ISSUE.
DOWNSTATE NURSING HOMES HAVE A
GREATER PERCENTAGE OF MEDICAID
RESIDENTS THAN UPSTATE HOMES,
WHO HAVE MORE PRIVATE PAY
RESIDENTS.
RUNION SAYS THIS IMBALANCE PUTS
LOCAL NURSING HOMES AT A
FINANCIAL DISADVANTAGE.
>> THE REASON THAT IT IS AN
UPSTATE/DOWNSTATE ISSUE IS
BECAUSE THE MEDICAID PIECE IS
FULLY REIMBURSABLE, AND THERE IS
A MUCH HIGHER PERCENTAGE OF
MEDICAID RESIDENTS IN NEW YORK
CITY.
SO THE MAJORITY OF THEIR
ASSESSMENT IS FULLY
REIMBURSABLE; WHEREAS IN UPSTATE
NEW YORK, IT'S A MUCH HIGHER
POPULATION OF PRIVATE PAY, AND
THOSE PRIVATE PAY PEOPLE ARE
FUNDING THIS INITIATIVE.
>> Matt: ASSEMBLYWOMAN SUSAN
JOHNS SAYS THE TAX WAS PART OF
THE HEALTH CARE BILL PUSHED
THROUGH BY GOVERNOR GEORGE
PATAKI AT THE URGING OF THE
HEALTH CARE WORKERS' UNION
S.D.I.U. 1199.
SHE RECOGNIZES THE FINANCIAL
NEED OF NURSING HOMES TO RECRUIT
AND RETAIN WORKERS BUT VOTED FOR
THE BILL BECAUSE OF ITS POSITIVE
IMPACT ON LOCAL HOSPITALS.
>> OUR AREA HOSPITALS RECEIVED
$18 MILLION IN ASSISTANCE UNDER
THE LEGISLATION, WHICH WAS VERY
IMPORTANT TO THEM IN TERMS OF
RECRUITMENT AND RETENTION OF
QUALIFIED AND CAPABLE STAFF, AND
WE ALL KNOW, IN THE ROCHESTER
AREA, THAT OUR HOSPITALS HAVE
BEEN STRUGGLING.
SO THIS LEGISLATION OFFERED SOME
IMPORTANT ASSISTANCE TO OUR
HOSPITALS.
WE UPSTATE LEGISLATORS, WE TRIED
TO GET THE GOVERNOR TO
UNDERSTAND THAT WE REALLY NEEDED
TO ALSO LOOK OUT FOR THE NURSING
HOMES AND THAT THIS ASSESSMENT,
WHILE IT WOULD BE RECUPERATED IN
PART FROM THE FEDERAL
GOVERNMENT, WAS GOING TO HAVE A
SIGNIFICANT IMPACT IN OUR AREA.
>> Matt: JOHNS SAYS SHE IS
SPONSORING LEGISLATION TO REPEAL
THE TAX AND HOPES A REPEAL COULD
BE A PART OF THE UPCOMING STATE
BUDGET PROCESS.
ASHLEY SAYS ACTION MUST BE TAKEN
SOON.
>> WHAT HAPPENS TODAY IS GOING
TO AFFECT US NOT ONLY TODAY.
IT'S GOING TO AFFECT US TOMORROW
AND NEXT YEAR AND THE YEAR
AFTER, BECAUSE WITH THE TYPES OF
NEGATIVE IMPACTS THIS IS GOING
TO HAVE ON THE NURSING HOMES AND
ON THE RECRUITMENT AND RETENTION
OF HEALTH CARE WORKERS ACROSS
THE SPECTRUM OF HEALTH CARE
BECAUSE IT JUST SENDS A BAD
MESSAGE TO ANYBODY THAT MIGHT BE
INTERESTED IN GOING INTO THE
HEALTH CARE PROFESSION.
(Music)
>> Elissa: THERE ARE MANY ITEMS
IN THE WORKS NOW TO TRY AND DEAL
WITH THE GRANNY TAX, AND WE HAVE
JIM DEVEAUX WITH US TONIGHT
WHO'S GOING TO TALK ABOUT THAT.
HE'S THE CHAIRMAN OF THE
ROCHESTER AREA ASSOCIATION OF
HOMES AND SERVICES FOR THE
AGING.
JIM, BESIDES WE JUST HEARD MATT
TALKING ABOUT THE NOTION THAT
PROBABLY THIS WILL BE RESCINDED
OR THEY WILL TRY AND RESCIND IT
AS PART OF THE BUDGET PROCESS,
THERE'S SOMETHING ELSE IN THE
WORKS, TOO, AN EXEMPTION AROUND
MEDICARE, RIGHT?
>> CORRECT.
THEY ARE NOW TALKING ABOUT
POSSIBLY ELIMINATING THE
MEDICARE REVENUE FROM THE TAX,
WHICH IS A POSITIVE STEP, MAKE
NO MISTAKE ABOUT IT.
UNFORTUNATELY, THOUGH, IT
REPRESENTS ABOUT TEN STEPS
BACKWARDS AND THIS REPRESENTS
MAYBE TWO STEPS FORWARD.
>> Elissa: OKAY.
WE HEAR A LOT FROM THOSE CORNERS
OF THE INDUSTRY, THE NURSING
HOME INDUSTRY, AND WE DO WANT TO
SAY THAT WE INVITED SOMEONE FROM
THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE TO BE WITH
US TONIGHT.
THEY WEREN'T ABLE TO PROVIDE
ANYONE TO BE WITH US FOR THIS
INTERVIEW.
BUT LET'S TALK A LITTLE BIT
ABOUT WHAT HAS BEEN CALLED
STAFFING CRISES ACROSS THE
HEALTH CARE INDUSTRY.
THE WORKFORCE RETENTION AND
RECRUITMENT ACT WOULD ASSIST
WITH SOME OF THOSE THINGS THAT
WERE HAPPENING EVEN IN NURSING
HOMES.
THERE WERE NURSING SHORTAGES AND
THOSE KIND OF THINGS, CORRECT?
>> ABSOLUTELY.
WE'VE BEEN SAYING FOR QUITE SOME
TIME THAT THERE'S A HUGE
SHORTAGE GOING ON OUT THERE AND
WE NEED TO ADDRESS IT, AND THE
GOVERNOR, TO HIS CREDIT,
ADDRESSED THAT IN THAT
LEGISLATION.
UNFORTUNATELY, BY IMPOSING ALSO
THE GRANNY TAX ON TOP OF IT, IT
HAS THE EFFECT OF ELIMINATING
THE FUNDING TO THE NURSING HOMES
THAT WE WOULD HAVE NORMALLY HAVE
USED FOR THAT.
SO IN ESSENCE HE HAS GIVEN US
MONEY WITH THE RIGHT HAND AND
HE'S TAKEN IT AWAY WITH THE
LEFT.
>> Elissa: WHAT ARE YOUR
THOUGHTS ABOUT RESCINDING THE
TAX NOW?
WHAT ARE YOU HEARING?
ARE YOU HEARING FROM LOCAL STATE
LAWMAKERS THAT -- WHAT ARE YOU
HEARING IS GOING TO HAPPEN?
>> WE'RE CERTAINLY HEARING THAT,
YOU KNOW, THIS WHOLE THING WAS
CREATED IN A BACK ROOM AMONG THE
THREE MAIN COMPONENTS OF OUR
LEGISLATION, AND OBVIOUSLY THERE
WASN'T A LOT OF THOUGHT PUT
BEHIND IT, AND I THINK A LOT OF
THE LEGISLATORS DIDN'T
UNDERSTAND THE FULL COMPLEMENT
OF WHAT WAS GOING ON.
NOW THERE'S A LOT OF
BACKPEDALING GOING ON, AND THEY
REALIZE THAT THIS REALLY WASN'T
A TAX ON NURSING HOMES BUT IT IN
FACT IS A TAX ON THE FRAIL
ELDERLY; AND THAT IS JUST
SOMETHING THAT IS POOR PUBLIC
POLICY TO TRY TO BALANCE THE
BOOKS OF THE STATE ON THE BACKS
OF THE FRAIL ELDERLY AND
ACTUALLY GOES BEYOND POOR PUBLIC
POLICY.
IT'S SHAMELESS, AND IF WE AS A
SOCIETY ALLOW THAT TO HAPPEN,
THEN SHAME ON US.
>> Elissa: THERE ARE, AS WE
SAID, MOVES IN THE WORKS TO DEAL
WITH IT.
ARE YOU HOPEFUL THAT IT WILL BE
DEALT WITH?
>> YEAH, I AM HOPEFUL.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, I CAN'T
PRETEND TO UNDERSTAND ALL THE
INS AND OUTS OF THE STATE
BUDGET, AND I REALIZE THAT
THERE'S ONLY SO MUCH OF THE PIE.
AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT IT COMES
DOWN TO, AND I THINK WHILE A LOT
OF PEOPLE WANT TO DO THE RIGHT
THING AND WANT TO ELIMINATE THE
TAX, THERE STILL IS THE QUESTION
ABOUT THEN WHERE DOES THE
REVENUE COME FROM?
AND THAT'S CERTAINLY A CHALLENGE
THAT THE STATE NEEDS TO DEAL
WITH.
THE OTHER PIECE THAT WE'RE
HEARING IS THAT THEY MAY BE
EXEMPTING THE MEDICARE REVENUE
FROM THE TAX, WHICH AGAIN IS
HUGE HELP AND WE'RE THANKFUL FOR
THAT BUT, YOU KNOW, I'VE SAID
BEFORE THAT IF A MAN THREATENS
TO BURN MY HOUSE AND THEN OFFERS
TO SAVE MY GARAGE, I'M A FOOL
NOT TO ACCEPT HIS ASSISTANCE;
BUT THANKFUL, I DON'T THINK SO.
>> Elissa: ALL RIGHT.
LET'S TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT
THE ISSUE OF MEDICAID
REIMBURSEMENT BECAUSE IT WAS
MENTIONED IN MATT'S STORY A
LITTLE BIT.
IT'S SUGGESTED SOME WOULD SAY
MORE SLOWLY, I GUESS 3% A YEAR
OVER THE YEARS SINCE 1983.
A LOT OF PEOPLE CALLED FOR
LONG-TERM PLANNING ON THE
STATE'S PART.
WHAT DO NURSING HOMES DO?
WHAT DO YOU DO TO DO LONG-TERM
PLANNING TO ADJUST FOR
REIMBURSEMENT BECAUSE YOUR COSTS
ARE SOARING?
>> RIGHT.
UNFORTUNATELY WE'RE FACED THESE
DAYS WITH THE COSTS OF HEALTH
CARE, MEDICATION, PHARMACEUTICAL
DRUGS, INSURANCE IS ANOTHER
THING THAT WE'RE SEEING IS GOING
TO INCREASE MAYBE 100%.
IT'S HARD TO DEAL WITH THOSE
TYPES OF INCREASES WHILE THE
GOVERNMENT IS GIVING YOU 3%
INFLATIONARY TRENDS EVERY YEAR.
WE'RE STILL BEING REIMBURSED ON
1983 COSTS THAT TEND TO GET
INCREASED YEAR TO YEAR.
THAT MAKES IT VERY DIFFICULT.
I KNOW AT KIRKHAVEN WE LOSE $50
A DAY ON OUR MEDICAID
REIMBURSEMENT.
OUR COST PER DAY IS ABOUT 181.
OUR MEDICAID COST IS ABOUT $131.
THE ONLY WAY THAT WE CAN
SUBSIDIZE THOSE LOSSES IS
THROUGH PRIVATE PAY RATES AND IN
THE MEDICARE REVENUE.
AND YET WHEN THEY START TAKING
HITS ON THE TAXATION OF THE
PRIVATE PAY DOLLARS, THAT BEGINS
TO ELIMINATE THAT SOURCE OF
FUNDING, AND NOW WE'RE ALSO
DEALING IN OCTOBER WITH THE
POTENTIAL OF 15 TO 17%
REDUCTIONS ON OUR MEDICARE
RATES, ALL OF THAT JUST MAKING
IT MORE AND MORE DIFFICULT FOR
HOMES TO PROVIDE THE KIND OF
CARE THEY WANT TO PROVIDE AND TO
BE ABLE TO MAKE A GO OF IT.
>> Elissa: THE ISSUE OF
SPENDING DOWN, ONCE MUCH TALKED
ABOUT SEVERAL YEARS AGO, SO THAT
-- EVEN IF YOU'RE SOMEBODY WHO
MAYBE COULD BE AN INDEPENDENT
PAYOR THAT YOU COULD SPEND DOWN
AND THEN YOU COULD GO ON TO
MEDICAID, MEDICARE.
HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH THAT THIS
THESE DAYS?
WHAT'S HAPPENING OUT THERE
REALLY?
>> WELL, OBVIOUSLY THERE ARE SO
MANY FAMILIES THAT TAKE
ADVANTAGE OF LEGAL LOOPHOLES TO
DO THAT, AND AS YOU TURN ON THE
TV ANY GIVEN EVENING AND YOU'LL
FIND SOMEBODY OUT THERE WHO'S
GOING TO OFFER TO HELP YOU
FIGURE OUT HOW TO SHELTER YOUR
ASSETS THAT YOU CAN GO ON
MEDICAID AND SHELTER YOUR ASSETS
FOR YOUR ESTATE.
THAT'S A PROBLEM, IT REALLY IS,
BECAUSE, AS I SAID BEFORE, WE
NEED THE PRIVATE PAY DOLLARS TO
SUBSIDIZE THE FACT THAT THE
STATE IS NOT PAYING FULL COSTS
FOR MEDICAID, AND THE MORE WE
SEE OF THINGS LIKE THE GRANNY
TAX, THE MORE WE SEE OF THE
ABILITY TO SHELTER YOUR ASSETS
AND GO ON MEDICAID, THE MORE
BURDEN THAT PUTS ON THE MEDICAID
PROGRAM.
>> Elissa: ARE YOU A LITTLE BIT
CONFLICTED IN TERMS OF WHAT THE
WORK FORCE RETENTION AND
RECRUITMENT ACT IS SUPPOSED TO
BE DOING AND WANTING TO SEE
BETTER WAYS...
>> ABSOLUTELY.
WE'RE DISCOURAGED BY IT BECAUSE,
ON ONE HAND WE HEAR THE GOVERNOR
AND ALL BOASTING ABOUT WHAT
THEY'VE DONE FOR THE HEALTH CARE
INDUSTRY.
>> Elissa: WHICH YOU THINK
NEEDS TO BE DONE?
>> ABSOLUTELY, IT NEEDS TO BE
DONE, AND WE'VE BEEN CRYING OUT
FOR IT FOR A LONG TIME.
THERE IS A NURSING SHORTAGE.
IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO HIRE AND
RECRUIT AND RETAIN GOOD HELP,
AND THE WAY TO GET THAT IS TO BE
ABLE TO BE ABLE TO GET MORE
MONEY FOR THE WORK THAT THEY DO.
AND I THINK THE GOVERNOR TOOK A
HUGE STEP IN MAKING AMENITIES
TOWARDS ACCOMPLISHING THAT; BUT
BY IMPOSING THE GRANNY TAX ON
TOP OF IT, AS WE SAID BEFORE, IT
BASICALLY WIPES OUT ALL THE
ADVANTAGES.
>> Elissa: ALL RIGHT.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH, JIM
DEVEAUX, FOR BEING WITH US FOR
THIS DISCUSSION.
THAT IS ALL THE TIME WE HAVE
UNFORTUNATELY FOR THIS TALK.
BUT FOR MORE INFORMATION ON THIS
LEGISLATION, YOU CAN LOG ON TO
OUR WEB SITE AT wxxi.org/ntk.
WHILE YOU'RE THERE YOU CAN ALSO
TAKE PART IN OUR WEEKLY SURVEY
QUESTION, AND FOR COMPREHENSIVE
DAILY COVERAGE OF STATE ISSUES
AND NEWS, IT'S nycitizens.org.
AND NOW IT'S TIME FOR THIS
WEEK'S EDITION OF THE BUSINESS
SECTION WITH THE "DEMOCRAT AND
CHRONICLE."
(Music)
AND JOINING US NOW IN STUDIO IS
ELLEN ROSEN.
SHE'S THE BUSINESS EDITOR OF
COURSE FOR THE "THE
DEMOCRAT
AND CHRONICLE."
ELLEN, BIG NEWS THIS WEEK FROM
XEROX.
CAN YOU HELP US SORT THAT OUT A
LITTLE BIT IN TERMS OF WHAT'S
HAPPENING WITH THIS SETTLEMENT?
BIG.
>> VERY BIG SETTLEMENT.
IT CAME WITH A
TEN-MILLION-DOLLAR FINE, WHICH
IS THE LARGEST FINE EVER LEVIED
BY THE S.E.C. FOR A TRANSACTION
OF THIS KIND, TRANSACTION
REPORTING.
YEAH, XEROX AND THE S.E.C. HAVE
BEEN NEGOTIATING FOR ALMOST A
COUPLE YEARS NOW REALLY OVER
SOME ACCOUNTING PRACTICES.
ACCOUNTING IS MORE OF AN ART
THAN A SCIENCE, A LOT OF PEOPLE
SAY.
>> Elissa: RIGHT.
>> AND SO SOME THINGS THAT MIGHT
BE CONSIDERED INTERPRETED AS
BEING LEGAL IN ONE WAY MIGHT BY
ANOTHER GROUP NOT BE, AND IT WAS
A QUESTION OF WHAT THE S.E.C.
FELT XEROX HAD ACCURATELY
ACCOUNTED FOR SOME OF ITS
LEASING, SOME OF THE FUNDS FROM
ITS LEASING OF EQUIPMENT.
AND SO THEY'VE BEEN NEGOTIATING
FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS ON THE
RESOLUTION, AND THE FINAL
RESOLUTION IS THAT XEROX NEITHER
ADMITS OR DENIES ANY WRONGDOING,
PAYS THE PENALTY AND RESTATES
EARNINGS BACK TO 1997.
>> Elissa: WHEN WE HEAR
REPORTING AND ACCOUNTING, WE
THINK ENRON, I THINK.
IS IT OF THAT ILK AT ALL OR NO?
>> I THINK THAT JUST EVERYBODY'S
MORE AWARE OF ACCOUNTING AND THE
FACT THAT IT'S NOT A SCIENCE,
AND I THINK MORE AND MORE
COMPANIES ARE BEING WATCHED, AND
THE S.E.C. IS REALLY BROADENING
ITS EXPANSE.
LAST YEAR I THINK THEY HAD
ENFORCEMENT ACTIONS AGAINST LIKE
500-SOMETHING PUBLIC COMPANIES.
SO THEY'RE REALLY JUST LOOKING
AT MORE AND MORE COMPANIES.
THEY'RE ALSO LOOKING INTO GLOBAL
CROSSINGS' FINANCE WE KNOW.
THAT SEEMS TO BE A LITTLE MORE
ENRON-LIKE THAN PERHAPS XEROX
DOES.
>> Elissa: ALL RIGHT.
SOMETHING ELSE IN THE NEWSPAPER
THIS WEEK, WEGMAN'S AND PRICING.
EXPLAIN THAT.
WHAT'S GOING ON THERE?
>> WELL, WEGMAN'S, THE GROCERY
BUSINESS HAS GOTTEN INCREASINGLY
COMPETITIVE, AND THIS IS
WEGMAN'S ANSWER TO ALDI'S COMING
TO TOWN AND TO WAL-MART SUPER
STORES AND B.J.'s AND SAM'S
WHOLESALE CLUBS.
WHAT WEGMAN'S STARTED AWHILE AGO
WAS A SMALL EXPERIMENT WITH
ABOUT 50 OF THEIR PRODUCTS,
REDUCING THE PRICES.
THEY WORKED WITH THEIR SUPPLIERS
TO TRY TO GET THE PRICES DOWN.
GROCERIES IS COMPLICATED.
THEY DON'T MAKE A LOT OF MONEY
ON THE INDIVIDUAL TRANSACTION.
THEY'RE RELYING ON VOLUME; SO
THEY WERE ABLE TO NEGOTIATE WITH
THEIR SUPPLIERS.
I THINK IT WAS PEANUT BUTTER,
EGGS AND A COUPLE OF OTHER
THINGS.
THEY BASICALLY FOUND THAT, WHEN
THEY DID THAT, SALES WERE HIGHER
ON THOSE PRODUCTS THAN WHEN THEY
WERE AT THEIR REGULAR
TRADITIONAL PRICE AND
OCCASIONALLY WENT ON SALE.
SO THEY'VE DECIDED THIS IS THEIR
NEW STRATEGY.
RIGHT NOW THEY'VE GOT 6,000
ITEMS THAT THEY'VE MARKED AT
THIS CONSISTENT LOW PRICE.
THEY'LL ALWAYS BE AT THAT PRICE,
BUT THEY SAY THEY'RE GOING TO
CONTINUE KNOCKING PRICES DOWN
UNTIL JULY.
>> Elissa: A LITTLE UNUSUAL TO
HEAR THAT FROM WEGMAN'S, ISN'T
IT, AND TO HEAR A STRATEGY LIKE
THIS AND TO TALK ABOUT IT TO THE
PUBLIC SO MUCH?
>> WELL, THE WAY THEY DID IT WAS
UNUSUAL.
IT'S MUCH MORE LIKE WEGMAN'S TO
HAVE A PRESS CONFERENCE, GET A
KIT OUT, GET EVERYBODY OUT
TALKING.
THEY DISTRIBUTED THAT VIDEO TO
SOMETHING LIKE A MILLION PEOPLE
IN ALL THE PLACES THEY HAVE
STORES, WHICH NOW IS
PENNSYLVANIA, NEW JERSEY, IN
ADDITION TO THIS AREA.
SO THE WAY THEY HANDLED IT WAS
KIND OF SURPRISING.
THEY HAVEN'T BEEN ANSWERING -- I
MEAN, THEY'LL ANSWER ANY
QUESTIONS, BUT NO ONE BEYOND
THEIR SPOKESWOMAN'S REALLY BEEN
SPEAKING ABOUT THIS.
I GUESS THEY'RE LETTING THE
THING -- THE PLAN SPEAK FOR
ITSELF.
>> Elissa: RIGHT, AND HOPING
THE CONSUMERS JUST CHECK IT OUT.
>> MM-HMM.
SO THEY'RE HOPING TO ATTRACT
CONSUMERS FROM OTHER STORES.
>> Elissa: OKAY, AND THE CHOICE
FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF ROCHESTER
THIS WEEK.
>> YEAH.
THAT WAS KIND OF A -- WASN'T
REALLY A SURPRISE.
I THINK IT'S WHERE PEOPLE
THOUGHT IT WAS GOING, BUT A LOT
OF PEOPLE ARE VERY UPSET AND
WORRIED ABOUT IT.
OUR MAJOR EMPLOYERS IN TOWN,
SEVERAL OF THEM, INCLUDING XEROX
AND KODAK, HAVE MOVED TO
SELF-INSURANCE, WHICH MEANS THAT
RATHER THAN PAYING PREMIUMS TO
AN INSURANCE COMPANY, THEY PAY
THE PREMIUMS THEMSELVES, BUT
THEY HIRE SOMEBODY TO ADMINISTER
THE PLAN.
BOTH XEROX AND KODAK WENT WITH
BLUE CROSS TO ADMINISTER THEIR
PLAN.
U of R LOOKED AT SEVERAL
COMPANIES, INCLUDING BLUE CROSS,
PREFERRED CARE AND UNITED HEALTH
CARE AND AETNA AND DECIDED TO GO
WITH AETNA.
A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED.
THERE ARE SOME CONCERNS ABOUT
AETNA'S PAST REPUTATION.
BUT WE HAD AETNA MANAGEMENT INTO
THE NEWS ROOM YESTERDAY, AND
THEY SAY THAT'S ALL BEHIND THEM.
THEY'RE A WELL-ORGANIZED COMPANY
WITH NEW MANAGEMENT, AND THEY
THINK EVERYTHING WILL BE FINE.
SO IT'S KIND OF A WAIT-AND-SEE
THING.
>> Elissa: HOW LONG DO YOU
THINK BEFORE U of R WILL DELIVER
THEIR REPORT ON THEIR
SATISFACTION, OR WILL THEY NOT
REALLY DO THAT?
WILL THEY KEEP THE PUBLIC
INFORMED ABOUT HOW THEY'RE
FEELING?
>> WELL, THIS GOES INTO EFFECT
IN JULY; SO I THINK IT WILL
REALLY BE AWHILE BEFORE WE
ACTUALLY SEE HOW IT PLAYS OUT
WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE
GETTING THEIR CLAIMS RETURNED
AND ALL THE NORMAL THINGS THAT
HAPPEN IN THE PROCESS OF HEALTH
INSURANCE.
SO I THINK IT WILL BE AWHILE.
WHETHER OR NOT THEY'LL
VOLUNTARILY INFORM THE PUBLIC, I
DON'T KNOW.
THEY'RE A PRIVATE COMPANY, BUT
CERTAINLY IT'S SOMETHING THAT
WE'LL BE WATCHING, AND I KNOW
THAT THE OTHER HEALTH INSURANCE
COMPANIES WILL BE WATCHING
ACTIVELY.
>> Elissa: I'M SURE THEY WILL.
WE'LL LOOK FOR REPORTING, OF
COURSE, IN THE "DEMOCRAT AND
CHRONICLE" IN THE WEEKS TO COME
AND OF COURSE ON THE WEEKEND.
ELLEN, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR
THIS WEEK'S REPORT.
AS WE SAID BEFORE IN THE
BEGINNING OF OUR PROGRAM, SPRING
IS IN THE AIR THIS WEEK, SORT
OF.
FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO HAVE MISSED
IT SO FAR, HERE IS A LOOK AT THE
DUTCH CONNECTION.
THAT'S GEORGE EASTMAN'S WINTER
IN BLOOM.
THIS COLORFUL EXHIBIT, WHICH IS
HELD IN FEBRUARY, FEATURED MORE
THAN 4,000 FLOWERING BULBS FROM
THE SAME HOLLAND GLOBE COMPANY
THAT EASTMAN HIMSELF ORDERED
FROM.
LET'S TAKE A LOOK.
(Music)
>> WE GOT STARTED EIGHT YEARS
AGO.
THIS IS OUR EIGHTH ANNIVERSARY.
THE IDEA CAME TO ME WHEN I WAS
LOOKING THROUGH HISTORIC
PHOTOGRAPHS OF Mr. EASTMAN'S
CONSERVATORY IN THE WINTERTIME
AROUND 1920, 1921, AND IT SHOWED
FORCED TULIPS AND HYACINTHS AND
DAFFODILS AND SAW, LOOKING
THROUGH HIS BUSINESS AND
PERSONAL CORRESPONDENCE THAT HE
ACTUALLY ORDERED LITERALLY 20 TO
26,000 BULBS, TULIPS AND
HYACINTHS EVERY YEAR, BUT IT'S
PRETTY MUCH THE SAME THING BASED
ON THE ORIGINAL ORDERS AND
PHOTOGRAPHS, AND SO IT'S
DESIGNED AS A RECREATION OF WHAT
HE WOULD HAVE HAD.
(Music)
WE HAVE TULIPS AND WE HAVE
HYACINTHS AND THOSE ARE BASED ON
THE ORDERS BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT
HE ORDERED EVERY YEAR.
WE'VE ADDED FRISCHAS BECAUSE YOU
CAN KEEP REFORCING FRISCHAS
EVERY YEAR.
WE SAVED THE BULBS AND KEEP
REUSING THEM EVERY YEAR.
WITH TULIPS AND HYACINTHS, YOU
CAN'T REFORCE THEM ONCE YOU'VE
DONE IT THE ONE TIME.
(Music)
WE HAVE FIVE DIFFERENT VARIETIES
OF THE TULIPS AND WE HAVE TWO
HYACINTH VARIETIES, AND WE HAVE
SHADES OF PURPLE, VARYING SHADES
OF PURPLE WITH YELLOW AS A
COMPLEMENTARY COLOR.
AND WE ALSO HAVE ORCHIDS ON
DISPLAY IN ALL THE PUBLIC ROOMS,
AND THEY'RE PROVIDED BY THE
GENESEE REGION ORCHID SOCIETY.
WE HAVE THEM FOR TWO WEEKS,
BECAUSE Mr. EASTMAN ALSO HAD
ORCHIDS.
(Music)
WHEN YOU'RE FORCING FLOWERS,
BULBS, TULIPS IN THIS CASE,
WE TRY TO HAVE THEM JUST COMING
INTO FLOWER, JUST HAVING SOME
COLOR AT THE BEGINNING OF THE
WEEK BECAUSE WE HAVE -- THEY
HAVE TO LAST 7 DAYS, AND THEN WE
COMPLETELY CHANGE UP THE SHOW
WITH A FRESH BATCH.
SO IT'S A LOT OF TIMING TO TRY
TO HAVE EVERYTHING IN FLOWER FOR
THE WEEKEND, BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN
THE MOST PEOPLE ARE HERE.
(Music)
>> Elissa: AND THE DUTCH
CONNECTION IS AN ANNUAL EVENT AT
THE GEORGE EASTMAN HOUSE.
LOOK FOR IT AGAIN NEXT FEBRUARY.
FOR MORE INFORMATION ON THIS AND
THE REST OF THIS WEEK'S EDITION
OF "NEED TO KNOW," YOU CAN LOG
ONTO wxxi.org/ntk.
AND THAT'S ALL FOR TONIGHT'S
PROGRAM.
WE'LL SEE YOU BACK HERE AGAIN
NEXT WEEK.
(Music)